Are dialects important to you?
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Originally posted by Rock^Star:
Most of the Indo Chinese in Java cannot speak mandarin or dialect, save for a few terms used here and there for money, holidays and greeting of relatives the traditional chinese way. Tks to Suharto who banned everything spoken or displayed in mandarin.
In Msia, dialects are still very widespoken with the most of Msian chinese speaking cantonese; penang and johor chinese speaking hokkien.
In Spore, dialects have been banned in the media and according to the old man, it hampers our ability to learn english and mandarin. I think it's a miracle if you can even grab a handful of teens who can speak dialects. Do you think it's such a waste if dialects die off like that?
(no f pap bullshit pls)
Dialects are important lo
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Originally posted by angel7030:
In taiwan, Hokkien is a language, not a dialect. We can read chinses character in hokkien, news in hokkien, show in hokkien, it gives us an identity and proud to use it as our nation icon. For english and chinese, it is up to individual to take it.
The French are proud of their local dialect, the Jap and Korean dun need english or chinese to be successful, so are the German.
Hokkien is not considered a common spoken language....period.
basically it is as good as cantonese without its own written language.
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Dialect in all sense it has its tradition and cultured value...these days dialect properly has little economics values. Other than Cantonese due to HK.
So it may perceived that Dialect may not be relevant.
You can always go to Shantou and enter their Teochew university and learned everything in Teochew but how on Earth are you going to use dialect in an international enviornment?
Back in the 30s 40s folks in China uses married to SEA to establish business network. It was never about language.
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And for those folks who think just because you are chinese and need to speak mandarin to be Chinese....that is even a laughing stock cause once you interact with mainland they will tell you that you are not Chinese because you "Think" and "conclude" differently.
That is why Singapore looks "Chinese" but think "Western" there is a political antidote here at play because China politics would expect comforming singapore to its own interest.
Its one aspect to learn how to write, and speak Mandarin. Its another to think alike just because identical skin color. That is a projection from a "Monolitics cultures" that is self center and uncompromising to alternatives.
So if you want to learn Mandarin do it for your own reason rather than listen to politician and foreigners to tell you that is your roots. Cause your roots is in Singapore a multi cultured community families.
Very soon Singaporean need to speak 4 languages to get around. So don't stop at Mandarin alone.
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this is what a man with too much power in possession can do to alter the behaviours of others or shape the society to what he desire
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the americans included numerals into math for convenience. dont use that as a comparison. go ask if they are willing to adopt arabic or chinese as their mother tongue and you have your answer.
chinese characters are complicated and difficult to remember. if you can get past this you will notice chinese is easy to learn. i believe it is the complicated strokes in chinese characters that turn most people off. it is easier to write in english isnt it? just mixed the alphabets and you get your word.
but thats only it. chinese is much much easier than english. it has no complicated sentence structure. (tense, prepositions, articles etc) if you are bilingual you will agree with me.
its sad that many chose english because of its benefit to their careers. the hongkongers didnt see the need to give up their mother tongue (cantonese). neither did the taiwanese, the japanese nor the koreans. but they are as successful as us, if not more!!!
we speak english because we have to. its too late to change that. but dont drop chinese and dialects because you believe its ok.
its not. its definitely not.
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Originally posted by Arapahoe:
Dialect in all sense it has its tradition and cultured value...these days dialect properly has little economics values. Other than Cantonese due to HK.
So it may perceived that Dialect may not be relevant.
You can always go to Shantou and enter their Teochew university and learned everything in Teochew but how on Earth are you going to use dialect in an international enviornment?
Back in the 30s 40s folks in China uses married to SEA to establish business network. It was never about language.
Just like Koreans and japanese, their Univerisity teaches them using their own languages, and for English, it is a secondary subject for them. But they still can thrive themselve in the international market, so are the German, french and Swedish. English come into our system because of the colonial era, where British flag was said to see no sunset and alway raising. More so are the ruler of the country who are english educated, but it does not mean that without English, you cannot make it to the international enviroment, Toyota chairman spoke no english, so is German Daimler Benz boss and french airbus CEOs. Even if they know english, it is only the basic, and they prefer to speak their own language so as to protray their own culture and brand, a total diversion from English.
Look at Canada, which i visited recently for a holiday cum business meeting, they speak 2 languages, French and English, and the french communities are doing business as good as the english communities. And if you are a French Canadian, english will be yr second language, but they chose to speak french first, if you cannot understand, then they speak English, and if you still cannot understand, they may try Singlish to you.
The Russian speak bad english, we call it the Russlish, the like of Singlish, but they are selling Mig planes and other business like hot cake to english speaking countries.
In conclusion, i would said english is not a must but a need in the international enviroment, as especially so in a business enviroment, if you know different languages of greeting, you are in and get welcomed.
Hokkien is official language in Taiwan, know as the Min nan Hua, same as china pu tong hua, Mandarin is used as a common language for all chinese around the world, and taiwan is no exception, they use it on media so as to be able to communciate with the world better, but if you speak Min nan Hua to a taiwanese, you are most welcome..in taiwan than a english speaking tourist,,,ho bo.
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Min nan hua is their language in Taiwan. Even politicians must practise to win the hearts of voters. The president ma practise speaking min nan hua.
Speaking Hakka also important to winning hakka speaking voters.
In ROC, language is important.
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i hate to say this but it seems only singaporean chinese are keen on english and feel so proud of it.
kns!!!
you may speak english like the caucasians but if you cant speak your own language and dialect what does that make you? you are nobody by a copy of the caucasians - a banana!!!
醒醒����
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Originally posted by dragg:
i hate to say this but it seems only singaporean chinese are keen on english and feel so proud of it.
kns!!!
you may speak english like the caucasians but if you cant speak your own language and dialect what does that make you? you are nobody by a copy of the caucasians - a banana!!!
醒醒����
I just think that it is totally narrow minded to just stuck in "Mandarin". The world moving forward requires individual to master a minimum of 3 to 4 languages to communicate.Rather than putting other folks down for speaking English and others and Calling them bananas.....move out of your nutshell and see what are other overseas Chinese are learning before name calling.
Just remember you learned a language to "Communicate"
The aspect of cultured value is reflected upon individual interest to pursue not social cohesion.
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Originally posted by Arapahoe:
I just think that it is totally narrow minded to just stuck in "Mandarin". The world moving forward requires individual to master a minimum of 3 to 4 languages to communicate.Rather than putting other folks down for speaking English and others and Calling them bananas.....move out of your nutshell and see what are other overseas Chinese are learning before name calling.
Just remember you learned a language to "Communicate"
The aspect of cultured value is reflected upon individual interest to pursue not social cohesion.
i am not against people taking up other languages.
maybe we are on different channels. i am talking about chinese not taking up the chinese language and speaking dialects.
as chinese, we must be able to speak our own language and dialects. i dont know why we even need to debate on this. i dont see the malays or the indians having so much trouble getting their people to learn their own languages.
its not me who came up with the term banana to describe 'a chinese who can only speak english'. i am not name-calling. i am just referring to it generally.
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Originally posted by -StarDust-:
Yup ROC rocognises the dialect. Their politician should mastered Hokkien to win the hearts of the ppl to vote for them.
. .. don't be fooled by angel7030 . . . . a fake taiwanese. . .. -
In fact, most singaporeans i noticed slang their english when talking to caucasians, and this make them look like a fool. Usually, caucasian will prefer we speak in our own accent, that give us our identitiy, speakingslang is like learning how to talk for the first time...haiz... and not all caucasian are from brit or USA. I have talk with many in my pub, and they clearly state that they prefer people to talk in a normal way...dun make yurself a fool and spoil their english.
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.. . .. it is very important to the older generation who are using . . dialects for communication. . . ..
. . . dialects . .. is a trace of . .. . the root . . ..
. .. while mandarin is the official . .. language in PRC . ...
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Originally posted by angel7030:
In fact, most singaporeans i noticed slang their english when talking to caucasians, and this make them look like a fool. Usually, caucasian will prefer we speak in our own accent, that give us our identitiy, speakingslang is like learning how to talk for the first time...haiz... and not all caucasian are from brit or USA. I have talk with many in my pub, and they clearly state that they prefer people to talk in a normal way...dun make yurself a fool and spoil their english.
. .. cesspit , stop derailing thread . .. . . it is about dialect here .. . . not English . .. .
.. .. pcb cesspit!
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Originally posted by angel7030:
In fact, most singaporeans i noticed slang their english when talking to caucasians, and this make them look like a fool. Usually, caucasian will prefer we speak in our own accent, that give us our identitiy, speakingslang is like learning how to talk for the first time...haiz... and not all caucasian are from brit or USA. I have talk with many in my pub, and they clearly state that they prefer people to talk in a normal way...dun make yurself a fool and spoil their english.
You are so full of yourself and totally crap in your response ....nobody is talking about English..
Get it straight.....
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Originally posted by dragg:
i am not against people taking up other languages.
maybe we are on different channels. i am talking about chinese not taking up the chinese language and speaking dialects.
as chinese, we must be able to speak our own language and dialects. i dont know why we even need to debate on this. i dont see the malays or the indians having so much trouble getting their people to learn their own languages.
its not me who came up with the term banana to describe 'a chinese who can only speak english'. i am not name-calling. i am just referring to it generally.
i am talking about chinese not taking up the chinese language and speaking dialects.
And i am saying you have to get pass the issued of RACE when you talk about language...? don't just learned the language because you identified yourself as a Race and coheres to learn Mandarin because of identity. But Rather where you are located.And in Singapore what is relevant There will be folks that find Mandarin is what they value ...... by all means. But For those who assume English or other language is what they choose to focus that should be a CHOICE.
You Speak the language where you grew up. There are 4 basic races infact they are all 4 languages are relevant.
Immigration has resulted in diverse cultural mingle together its is hard to contain yourself with monolitics language and cultures.
In South America there are 3rd generation of koreans, Chinese that grew up and speak spanish, In Europes there are Asian, Chinese that are born and grew up in Europes.
There are foreigners who speak fluent mandarin......who had remain in Asia for a long time that they reside here in Asia.
Like i say open up your mind and go beyond the subject of RACE is equal to language....
To ADD:
What about mixed Races.......?
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Dialects are important to me because they are the only living evidence that can lead to the reconstruction of how Ancient Chinese Language was.
If dialects die off, or becomes whitewashed through natural sociolinguistical evolution, we will have one less route to the tracing of language evolution.
Same for any other language on the Earth.
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Originally posted by BanguIzai:
Dialects are important to me because they are the only living evidence that can lead to the reconstruction of how Ancient Chinese Language was.
If dialects die off, or becomes whitewashed through natural sociolinguistical evolution, we will have one less route to the tracing of language evolution.
Same for any other language on the Earth.
Languages and dialects evolve with time. Every generation will demolish and build new words. However many root words will survive throughout.
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Originally posted by Clivebenss:
Languages and dialects evolve with time. Every generation will demolish and build new words. However many root words will survive throughout.
give example
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Originally posted by BanguIzai:
give example
you're the linguist.
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Originally posted by Clivebenss:
you're the linguist.
no la
i just want to see examples with regards to the statement "However many root words will survive throughout"
however in my opinion "may survive" has been much more observable than "will survive"
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Originally posted by BanguIzai:
no la
i just want to see examples with regards to the statement "However many root words will survive throughout"
however in my opinion "may survive" has been much more observable than "will survive"
ok.
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I wanna master teochew.
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I know hokkien by young and learnt cantonese from songs and dramas...
They can dun teach you but they can't stop you from learning....
Just like they can try to kept secrets from us and that do not prevent us to find out...