My comments on craving
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Posting here for discussion. If you have comments, or you disagree, voice out!
I once went to a bookstore and flipped through a very interesting book on how to quit nicotine. The author used to smoke 40 sticks a day, he's a chain smoker, but managed to quit it entirely through correct understanding of the nature of nicotine and nicotine craving.
He says there is nothing great about nicotine at all except that it relieves craving temporarily (in the same way eating food relieves hunger temporarily) giving a false illusion about the greatness of nicotine, but if you don't have that craving or need to begin with, why will you need nicotine? So nicotine is not in itself something great, but it gives temporary relieve to the craving so it is misperceived as something good. It is actually just to satisfy the pathetic nicotine addiction... nothing else. So in order to quit successfully all we have to do is to change our false perception about nicotine. I only read a bit but it is quite an interesting book. Later on, I discovered a sutta that gave a rather similar analogy.
Also not just for smoking cravings but basically every situation: for relationships and sexual desires, if you are straight, you aren't attracted to same sex people and you won't find pleasure in same sex relationship (well you do but in a non-sexual friendship manner which is a different story), so basically the pleasure is dependent on your particular inclinations and craving, so isn't it the same as the smoking case? I can say the same with food, etc, since one type of food can seem very nice to someone but not nice to someone else (e.g. durian), so the pleasure is dependent on your particular inclinations and craving, so the pleasure is derived simply from your craving, and craving arise due to grasping on things falsely (there are also other conditions and factors but those are not primary ones) - that is, to see things as permanent, pleasurable, self/mine.This is why, like the Nicotine case the author adviced, all you need is correct perception of reality and the nature of craving to resolve the problem. In Buddhism, we say the solution lies in seeing clearly the impermanence, suffering, and no-self nature, and the empty nature of everything, seeing thus leads to dispassion and letting go.
So if we understand the four noble truths, we understand that craving is the cause of suffering, that the pleasure we perceive are not true pleasures but 'diseased pleasures' arising due to the disease of craving similar to how scratching a sore wound or splashing boiling water if you are a leper may seem pleasurable, or a person 'diseased' with nicotine addiction may find nicotine very great when actually it isn't, and the end of craving is the end of suffering through the practice of noble eightfold path, then we have correct understanding, and this correct understanding is what is going to liberate us.
Also here is what the Buddha says about the leper who takes pleasure in being scorched:
http://www.accesstoi....075x.than.html
"Magandiya, suppose that there was a leper covered with sores and infections, devoured by worms, picking the scabs off the openings of his wounds with his nails, cauterizing his body over a pit of glowing embers. His friends, companions, & relatives would take him to a doctor. The doctor would concoct medicine for him, and thanks to the medicine he would be cured of his leprosy: well & happy, free, master of himself, going wherever he liked. Then suppose two strong men, having grabbed him with their arms, were to drag him to a pit of glowing embers. What do you think? Wouldn't he twist his body this way & that?"
"Yes, master Gotama. Why is that? The fire is painful to the touch, very hot & scorching."
"Now what do you think, Magandiya? Is the fire painful to the touch, very hot & scorching, only now, or was it also that way before?"
"Both now & before is it painful to the touch, very hot & scorching, master Gotama. It's just that when the man was a leper covered with sores and infections, devoured by worms, picking the scabs off the openings of his wounds with his nails, his faculties were impaired, which was why, even though the fire was actually painful to the touch, he had the skewed perception of 'pleasant.'"
"In the same way, Magandiya, sensual pleasures in the past were painful to the touch, very hot & scorching; sensual pleasures in the future will be painful to the touch, very hot & scorching; sensual pleasures at present are painful to the touch, very hot & scorching; but when beings are not free from passion for sensual pleasures — devoured by sensual craving, burning with sensual fever — their faculties are impaired, which is why, even though sensual pleasures are actually painful to the touch, they have the skewed perception of 'pleasant.'
"Now suppose that there was a leper covered with sores & infections, devoured by worms, picking the scabs off the openings of his wounds with his nails, cauterizing his body over a pit of glowing embers. The more he cauterized his body over the pit of glowing embers, the more disgusting, foul-smelling, & putrid the openings of his wounds would become, and yet he would feel a modicum of enjoyment & satisfaction because of the itchiness of his wounds. In the same way, beings not free from passion for sensual pleasures — devoured by sensual craving, burning with sensual fever — indulge in sensual pleasures. The more they indulge in sensual pleasures, the more their sensual craving increases and the more they burn with sensual fever, and yet they feel a modicum of enjoyment & satisfaction dependent on the five strings of sensuality.
"Now what do you think, Magandiya? Have you ever seen or heard of a king or king's minister — enjoying himself, provided & endowed with the five strings of sensuality, without abandoning sensual craving, without removing sensual fever — who has dwelt or will dwell or is dwelling free from thirst, his mind inwardly at peace?"
"No, master Gotama."
"Very good, Magandiya. Neither have I ever seen or heard of a king or king's minister — enjoying himself, provided & endowed with the five strings of sensuality, without abandoning sensual craving, without removing sensual fever — who has dwelt or will dwell or is dwelling free from thirst, his mind inwardly at peace. But whatever priests or contemplatives who have dwelt or will dwell or are dwelling free from thirst, their minds inwardly at peace, all have done so having realized — as it actually is present — the origination & disappearance, the allure, the danger, & the escape from sensual pleasures, having abandoned sensual craving and removed sensual fever."
Then at that moment the Blessed One exclaimed,
Freedom from disease: the foremost good fortune. Unbinding: the foremost ease. The eightfold: the foremost of paths going to the Deathless, Secure.
When this was said, Magandiya the wanderer said to the Blessed One, "It's amazing, master Gotama. It's astounding, how this, too, is well-stated by master Gotama: 'Freedom from disease: the foremost good fortune. Unbinding: the foremost ease.' We have also heard this said by earlier wanderers in the lineage of our teachers: 'Freedom from disease: the foremost good fortune. Unbinding: the foremost ease.' This agrees with that."
"But as for what you have heard said by earlier wanderers in the lineage of your teachers, Magandiya — 'Freedom from disease: the foremost good fortune. Unbinding: the foremost ease' — which freedom from disease is that, which Unbinding?"
When this was said, Magandiya the wanderer rubbed his own limbs with his hand. "This is that freedom from disease, master Gotama," he said. "This is that Unbinding. For I am now free from disease, happy, and nothing afflicts me."
"Magandiya, it's just as if there were a man blind from birth who couldn't see black objects... white... blue... yellow... red... or pink objects; who couldn't see even or uneven places, the stars, the sun, or the moon. He would hear a man with good eyesight saying, 'How wonderful, good sirs, is a white cloth — beautiful, spotless, & clean.' He would go in search of something white. Then another man would fool him with a grimy, oil-stained rag: 'Here, my good man, is a white cloth — beautiful, spotless, & clean.' The blind man would take it and put it on. Having put it on, gratified, he would exclaim words of gratification, 'How wonderful, good sirs, is a white cloth — beautiful, spotless, & clean.' Now what do you think, Magandiya? When that man blind from birth took the grimy, oil-stained rag and put it on; and, having put it on, gratified, exclaimed words of gratification, 'How wonderful, good sirs, is a white cloth — beautiful, spotless, & clean': Did he do so knowing & seeing, or out of faith in the man with good eyesight?"
"Of course he did it not knowing & not seeing, master Gotama, but out of faith in the man with good eyesight."
"In the same way, Magandiya, the wanderers of other sects are blind & eyeless. Without knowing freedom from disease, without seeing Unbinding, they still speak this verse:
Freedom from disease: the foremost good fortune. Unbinding: the foremost ease.
"This verse was stated by earlier worthy ones, fully self-awakened:
Freedom from disease: the foremost good fortune. Unbinding: the foremost ease. The eightfold: the foremost of paths going to the Deathless, Secure.
"But now it has gradually become a verse of run-of-the-mill people.
"This body, Magandiya, is a disease, a cancer, an arrow, painful, an affliction. And yet you say, with reference to this body, which is a disease, a cancer, an arrow, painful, an affliction: 'This is that freedom from disease, master Gotama. This is that Unbinding,' for you don't have the noble vision with which you would know freedom from disease and see Unbinding."
"I'm convinced, master Gotama, that you can teach me the Dhamma in such a way that I would know freedom from disease, that I would see Unbinding."
"Magandiya, it's just as if there were a man blind from birth who couldn't see black objects... white... blue... yellow... red... the sun or the moon. His friends, companions, & relatives would take him to a doctor. The doctor would concoct medicine for him, but in spite of the medicine his eyesight would not appear or grow clear. What do you think, Magandiya? Would that doctor have nothing but his share of weariness & disappointment?"
"Yes, master Gotama."
"In the same way, Magandiya, if I were to teach you the Dhamma — 'This is that freedom from disease; this is that Unbinding' — and you on your part did not know freedom from disease or see Unbinding, that would be wearisome for me; that would be troublesome for me."
"I'm convinced, master Gotama, that you can teach me the Dhamma in such a way that I would know freedom from disease, that I would see Unbinding."
"Magandiya, it's just as if there were a man blind from birth who couldn't see black objects... white... blue... yellow... red... the sun or the moon. Now suppose that a certain man were to take a grimy, oil-stained rag and fool him, saying, 'Here, my good man, is a white cloth — beautiful, spotless, & clean.' The blind man would take it and put it on.
"Then his friends, companions, & relatives would take him to a doctor. The doctor would concoct medicine for him: purges from above & purges from below, ointments & counter-ointments and treatments through the nose. And thanks to the medicine his eyesight would appear & grow clear. Then together with the arising of his eyesight, he would abandon whatever passion & delight he felt for that grimy, oil-stained rag. And he would regard that man as an enemy & no friend at all, and think that he deserved to be killed. 'My gosh, how long have I been fooled, cheated, & deceived by that man & his grimy, oil-stained rag! — "Here, my good man, is a white cloth — beautiful, spotless, & clean."'
"In the same way, Magandiya, if I were to teach you the Dhamma — 'This is that freedom from Disease; this is that Unbinding' — and you on your part were to know that freedom from Disease and see that Unbinding, then together with the arising of your eyesight you would abandon whatever passion & delight you felt with regard for the five clinging-aggregates. And it would occur to you, 'My gosh, how long have I been fooled, cheated, & deceived by this mind! For in clinging, it was just form that I was clinging to... it was just feeling... just perception... just fabrications... just consciousness that I was clinging to. With my clinging as a requisite condition, there arises becoming... birth... aging & death... sorrow, lamentation, pains, distresses, & despairs. And thus is the origin of this entire mass of stress.'"
"I'm convinced, master Gotama, that you can teach me the Dhamma in such a way that I might rise up from this seat cured of my blindness."
"In that case, Magandiya, associate with men of integrity. When you associate with men of integrity, you will hear the true Dhamma. When you hear the true Dhamma, you will practice the Dhamma in accordance with the Dhamma. When you practice the Dhamma in accordance with the Dhamma, you will know & see for yourself: 'These things are diseases, cancers, arrows. And here is where diseases, cancers, & arrows cease without trace. With the cessation of my clinging comes the cessation of becoming. With the cessation of becoming comes the cessation of birth. With the cessation of birth then aging & death, sorrow, lamentation, pain, distress, & despair all cease. Such is the cessation of this entire mass of suffering & stress."
When this was said, Magandiya the wanderer said, "Magnificent, Master Gotama! Magnificent! Just as if he were to place upright what was overturned, to reveal what was hidden, to point out the way to one who was lost, or to carry a lamp into the dark so that those with eyes could see forms, in the same way has Master Gotama — through many lines of reasoning — made the Dhamma clear. I go to Master Gotama for refuge, to the Dhamma, & to the community of monks. Let me obtain the going forth in Master Gotama's presence, let me obtain admission."
"Anyone, Magandiya, who has previously belonged to another sect and who desires the going forth & admission in this doctrine & discipline, must first undergo probation for four months. If, at the end of four months, the monks feel so moved, they give him the going forth & admit him to the monk's state. But I know distinctions among individuals in this matter."
"Master Gotama, if anyone who has previously belonged to another sect and desires the going forth & admission in this doctrine & discipline must first undergo probation for four months; and if, at the end of four months, the monks feel so moved, they give him the going forth & admit him to the monk's state; then I am willing to undergo probation for four years. If, at the end of four years, the monks feel so moved, let them give me the going forth & admit me to the monk's state."
Then Magandiya the wanderer received the going forth & the admission in the Blessed One's presence. And not long after his admission — dwelling alone, secluded, heedful, ardent, & resolute — he in no long time reached & remained in the supreme goal of the holy life, for which clansmen rightly go forth from home into homelessness, knowing & realizing it for himself in the here & now. He knew: "Birth is ended, the holy life fulfilled, the task done. There is nothing further for the sake of this world." And thus Ven. Magandiya became another one of the arahants. -
One example from my own life is perhaps the occasional addiction to korean drama and movies.
They are all illusory yet, and these characters do not exist, yet how can it be that i am so attached to the outcomes and fates of the characters. It seems to fill some existential void in me or something. Or maybe the 'love' in the show is so compelling and fulfills some sense of loneliness in me and somehow lets me escape into an alternate reality.
Without true insight, i really do think that it is hard to escape the temptations of this samsaric world.
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Thanks for your sharing. Indeed it often has to do with filling a perceived void... it thinks that pleasures can satisfy that void but that misconception itself leads to craving, clinging and suffering. That perceived pleasure itself is a result of the disease of taking suffering to be pleasure, like taking boiling water as pleasurable, or scratching a sore wound as pleasurable. If there is no craving to begin with, there will be peace.
This is like feeling a bad diarrhea and stomachache then going to toilet to shit feels very shiok but actually there is nothing shiok about shitting and if given a choice you prefer not to have diarrhea
Craving, attachment, brings much suffering and harm and yet we constantly indulge in them in delusion so we can never find the peace and happiness of nirvana. Now that we know the possibility of nirvana, we should strive and make an effort.
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Yes, as a Buddhist, one should know better. Yet it is like a spell-bind. One can't let go of these inherent inclinations. And waste much time as a result.
I do not feel too much guilt though, although i would not repeat this too often (i hope). But i feel that every experience can provide some kind of learning opportunity if we can see it that way.
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I would say the most fundamental want of all is the need to do away with suffering. I reckon we would gladly burn suffering away, if just by doing that alone will make suffering kaput.
The reason why there are addictions - be it to nicotine, alcohol, movies, relationships, etc. - is because people do not know how/where to seek higher forms of happiness. Hence to many, many people, indulging in temporal comforts is better than nothing. It is for lack of knowing how to be free from the crazy cycle of craving and disappointment that people continue on their merry-go-round.
So I suppose this begs the question, "What frees?"
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For now, let me go reach for that cream puff...
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Nirvana seems so far away... I always feel that it would take me many many more life times of practice before I will be able to be completely free from suffering. Frankly, that thought can be quite discouraging at times.
Meanwhile, what am I to do as a worldly creature? I am not yet at the level where I can meditate long hours every day with no cravings for anything else - I wish I were. Hence I still need worldly pleasures to fill the void.
Are desires/cravings really so bad if one can be fully aware not to be attached to them? For example, if one is able to remind oneself to not be attached to a good plate of char kway tiao and remind oneself that nothing is permanent, is it still not ok to let oneself fully enjoy its flavour every now and then?
Or are desires/cravings intrinsically unwholesome and one ought to work towards ridding oneself of all desires/cravings?
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Thx for sharing
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"There is, O monks, worldly joy,[1] there is unworldly joy, and there is a still greater unworldly joy. There is worldly happiness,[2] there is unworldly happiness, and there is a still greater unworldly happiness. There is worldly equanimity, there is unworldly equanimity, and there a still greater unworldly equanimity. There is worldly freedom, there is unworldly freedom, and there is a still greater unworldly freedom.
"Now, O monks, what is worldly joy? There are these five cords of sense desire: forms cognizable by the eye that are wished for and desired, agreeable and endearing, associated with sense-desire and tempting to lust. Sounds cognizable by the ear... odors cognizable by the nose... flavors cognizable by the tongue... tangibles cognizable by the body, wished for and desired, agreeable and endearing, associated with sense-desire and tempting to lust. It is the joy that arises dependent on these five cords of sense desire which is called 'worldly joy.'
"Now what is unworldly joy? Quite secluded from sense desires, secluded from unwholesome states of mind, a monk enters upon and abides in the first meditative absorption,[3] which is accompanied by thought-conception and discursive thinking, and has joy and happiness born of seclusion. With the stilling of thought-conception and discursive thinking, he enters upon and abides in the second meditative absorption which has internal confidence and singleness of mind without thought conception and discursive thinking, and has joy and happiness born of concentration. This is called 'unworldly joy.'
"And what is the still greater unworldly joy? When a taint-free monk looks upon his mind that is freed of greed, freed of hatred, freed of delusion, then there arises joy. This called a 'still greater unworldly joy.'
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/sn/sn36/sn36.031.nypo.html
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allkosong: dont think it is far away but think that it is only a matter of time we awaken, we just have to put in extra effort to make it happen. but first you must understand the teachings and how to practice. you dont have to meditate many hours everyday, even i dont do that
pegembara: thanks for sharing this impt sutta. indeed i gave another analogy, to hell denizens, ghost realm seems like heaven and human realm is even better. but to us, ghost realm is hellish. to deva realm, human realm seems hellish.
to us, pleasures of the five senses is heaven, but to brahmas they are truly shit and disgusting, only the jhanic absorptions are pure. this is why buddha said, "his faculties were impaired, which was why, even though the fire was actually painful to the touch, he had the skewed perception of 'pleasant.'"
but even so, you cant even compare deva realm to nirvana. even deva realm is suffering when compared to nirvana. In other words, even deva realm is shit and full of suffering. thats why to paraphrase buddha (not exact words), even if it is a little bit of shit, it is still shit and not recommended. not the tiniest bit of samsara is recommendable - all clinging and all samsaric realms is suffering. the end of afflictions is the only true happiness.
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Originally posted by An Eternal Now:
not the tiniest bit of samsara is recommendable - all clinging and all samsaric realms is suffering. the end of afflictions is the only true happiness.
so true. I hope many people will quickly understand this from the bottom of their hearts before it's too late. Including myself.
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There is an ''everlasting lite'' within oneself but it is overlooked and one looks outside for ... Hence one misses what is (isness) Instead, one see this (lite) that shines on objects and starting searching, seeking or chasing on something that is outer when in reality it is a mere reflection from within. In other words, one is actually seeing the refelctions of the light within oneself on objects outside of oneself. When one is looking outside of oneself, it is craving! When one is looking outside (searching, seeking) of oneself, it is craving! When one understands this misperceiving one turns inwards, of course, it presupposes that one is not content with the finger but attuned to the hinting of the finger pointing to the moon.