wow this guy has reached 'Nirvana'
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That's what he claims.
http://www.youtube.com/user/NondualAwareness
About Me:I have reached natural state, Nirvana.
I know what the Christ, Buddha and all the Great Sages knew.
I can guide those who are ready and willing toward the same truth. -
any tom, dick and harry can say and claim what he wants.
I can say I am a Buddha even, you believe me?
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Originally posted by Rooney9:
any tom, dick and harry can say and claim what he wants.
I can say I am a Buddha even, you believe me?
I say, do you know what is sarcasm?
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IMHO every person when really drunk is in Nirvana.
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Ordinally happiness when ended, suffering occur there after.
Know that suffering is real, and happiness is false. As suffering don't become happiness, but happiness can become suffering.
Example, when eating good food. Eating your favourite food is happiness. But, if you were to continue to eat bowl after bowl of the same food, it becomes a suffering. This is how happiness become suffering. happiness if continuous become suffering. But suffering if continue does not become happiness.
Example, when hungry, i am experiencing suffering. If one continue to stay hungry for 7 days, one will experience more suffering, not happiness. So suffering is real, and happiness is false.
Now neither suffering nor happiness is a good experience/realm. But one cannot sustain this state as time waits for no man.
Example when we are born, we are already walking towards the deathbed. Who can stop moving? None.
But it's said that in Nirvanic Bliss(Ulitmate Joy), there's no all above three forms of sufferings.
In this samsara world there's duality. Suffering and joy is Prejudiced view for one side or the other. If Ulitmate Joy has no suffering, then Joy is also gone. As it's on the same side with suffering. One gone, the other is gone too. It's when both suffering and joy is ended that bring forth the Ulitmate Reality of Nirvana (aka 極樂, Ulitmate Bliss). Thus called True bliss/joy. If there's joy, then joy is suffering and False. Ulitmate Joy is indeed inconcievable! Inconcievable mean cannot be said, nor cannot be think nor cannot be percieve.
Samsara is dimension of matter/karma controlling, you can't have your own wish or doing, hence suffering. Nirvana is a state/dimension of Mind/will/vow controlling, hence no suffering. There's this Utimate reality Buddha discovered.
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I dunno how the Nirvana can be differentiated, one for Arhats, the other for Buddha, according to Mahayana tradition.
what about pacceka Buddha?
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Helping AEN post a comment. (Problem posting from handphone.)
This guy who is proclaiming Nirvana is actually at Thusness' Stage 4, which is not Buddhist enlightenment.
http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2007/03/thusnesss-six-stages-of-experience.html
Also, non-dual awareness is blissful, but not liberating. Hence, it is not about the end of suffering as he claims.
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Originally posted by Rooney9:
I dunno how the Nirvana can be differentiated, one for Arhats, the other for Buddha, according to Mahayana tradition.
what about pacceka Buddha?
our take according to Mahayana is that arahat(not "maha"-Arahat) indeed severed affflictions and attachment, but still have the habits of attachment/higher form of greed. pacceka Buddha on the other hand had no more habits of attachment, but still have dualism/higher form of hatred. then bodhisttvas go on to sever dualism, but still have dualism habits. if there's no more dualism habits, then he's a buddha, within the ten realm, not full Buddha yet, he still have wandering thoughts/higher form of folly. if no more wandering thoughts then he's a real Full Buddha. but this also need a standard 3 great Asankhyeya kalpas. the time is also to collect merits and omniscience.
阿罗汉è§�æ€�烦æ�¼æ–了，也就是执著æ–äº†ï¼Œæ‰§è‘—ä¹ æ°”æ²¡æ–ï¼Œé˜¿ç½—æ±‰æœ‰ä¹ æ°”ï¼›å¦‚æžœä¹ æ°”æ–掉之å�Žï¼Œå°±å�«è¾Ÿæ”¯ä½›ï¼Œä¸�å�«é˜¿ç½—æ±‰ï¼Œè¾Ÿæ”¯ä½›æ˜¯è¿žæ‰§è‘—ä¹ æ°”éƒ½æ²¡æœ‰äº†ï¼Œä½†æ˜¯ä»–æœ‰åˆ†åˆ«ï¼Œæ‰§è‘—ä¹ æ°”æ²¡æœ‰äº†ï¼Œä»–æœ‰åˆ†åˆ«ï¼›åˆ†åˆ«æ–掉之å�Žï¼Œä»–å�‡ä¸€çº§ï¼Œä»–å�«è�©è�¨ï¼Œä»–ä¸�å�«è¾Ÿæ”¯ä½›ï¼Œå�«è�©è�¨ï¼Œè�©è�¨æœ‰åˆ†åˆ«çš„ä¹ æ°”ï¼›åˆ†åˆ«çš„ä¹ æ°”æ–掉之å�Žï¼Œä»–å�«å�šä½›äº†ï¼Œå��法界里é�¢çš„佛；å��æ³•ç•Œçš„ä½›åˆ†åˆ«çš„ä¹ æ°”æ–了，他还有起心动念，起心动念是妄想，什么时候妄想æ–了，ä¸�起心ã€�ä¸�动念了，他就超越å��法界，就到一真法界去，这是真佛。å��法界里é�¢çš„ä½›å�«ç›¸ä¼¼ä½›ï¼Œä¸�是真的，相似，很åƒ�，ä¸�是真的；起心动念æ–掉，这æ‰�是真的。--净空法师开示
i'm inline with Namdrol on this thread:http://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f=69&t=5102regarding sudden/gradual enlightenment. final aim is full enlightenment. sudden is almost impossible. frm 1st stage to full need 3 great asankhyeya kalpas, where they complete the accumulating of merit and omniscience (二足two collections). its non practice state of letting ignorance habit wear off itself. "There is no difference at all in the realization of emptiness of a first stage bodhisattva and a Buddha. But there is a difference in affliction and omniscience."
in PL school, Amitabha just achieved Buddhahood 10 great kalpa ago. and those achieved Buddhahood within this period in PL are innumberable, more than half the populations in PL, so can rough average 5,6,7 kalpa to achieved Buddhahood, which is inconcievable comparing to 3 great asankhyeya kalpas.
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Another interesting video:
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IMHO every person when really drunk is in Nirvana.
hmm, though it's imho, but still quite insulting. drunk is not knowing what they are doing. and similarly like taking drug/intoxication is being high, also not knowing what they are doing. Buddhism have preventive precepts against drinking/intoxication.
Nirvana would be serene; at peace; calm and as Clear, as Awake and all Knowing as ever.
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Originally posted by sinweiy:
our take according to Mahayana is that arahat(not "maha"-Arahat) indeed severed affflictions and attachment, but still have the habits of attachment/higher form of greed. pacceka Buddha on the other hand had no more habits of attachment, but still have dualism/higher form of hatred. then bodhisttvas go on to sever dualism, but still have dualism habits. if there's no more dualism habits, then he's a buddha, within the ten realm, not full Buddha yet, he still have wandering thoughts. if no more wandering thoughts then he's a real Full Buddha. but this also need a standard 3 great Asankhyeya kalpas. the time is also to collect merits and omniscience.
I strongly disagreed on the attachment/higher form of greed for arhats. just goes against what the Buddha has taught. if there are still greed, how can one attain enlightenment.
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Originally posted by realization:
Helping AEN post a comment. (Problem posting from handphone.)
This guy who is proclaiming Nirvana is actually at Thusness' Stage 4, which is not Buddhist enlightenment.
http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2007/03/thusnesss-six-stages-of-experience.html
Also, non-dual awareness is blissful, but not liberating. Hence, it is not about the end of suffering as he claims.
he says he is at stage 5 to 6 worr..
interesting how he laid it out in those steps.
i couldnt hold my attention so much
but i'd say i am between what he describes as phase 5-6
and quite frankly i dont care to think or bother with understanding this intellectualising anymore
what i describe is that i've seen through the illusion of self-image
which to me is the most important in the psychological revolution of man
that will lead to peace and harmonious relationships.
you see all intellectualising is a dream of interpretation.
i have returned to mother natures arms, the universal flow.
there is no longer a need for a "me or I" to be doing anything
nature does not harm, it is harmonious with everything
as of now i choose to come back into intellectual expression to free others
who are still stuck in this intellectualising realm. does the universe require an interpretation? no it does not. this is what my work is trying to do, break down the mechanisms for pointless interpretation
awake from the dream and surrender yourself back to nature. That is my work
call this whatever you like and others can put steps and phases also, its not important.
important thing is that you awake from the dream if it is becoming a nightmare.
My dream turned into nightmare and I woke up. That's all that matters and i know that others are having nightmares, I shake their bodies in attempt to wake up these people because of compassion -
Originally posted by whylikethatah:
he says he is at stage 5 to 6 worr..
yes thats right. the purpose the Buddha expounded the dhamma was so that people can end their suffering. that was his sole purpose of becoming a Buddha.
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Originally posted by Rooney9:
I strongly disagreed on the attachment/higher form of greed for arhats. just goes against what the Buddha has taught. if there are still greed, how can one attain enlightenment.
?? i did said arahats indeed don't have attachment/higher form of greed. -
Originally posted by sinweiy:
?? i did said arahats indeed don't have attachment/higher form of greed.quote:-
our take according to Mahayana is that arahat(not "maha"-Arahat) indeed severed affflictions and attachment, but still have the habits of attachment/higher form of greed.what u mean by still have the habits of attachment/higher form of greed? still have means not yet. how can that be. I find it unbelievable. when you attain enlightenment, you become arhat isnt it. this is your last birth and end of suffering is achieved.
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yes they still have habitual spontaneous "reaction" of the greed that maybe due to so long period in the past become sort of uncontrollable. the mind really no greed, and they CAN end samsara of the six realm. but the body sometimes can act out of a sudden without the intention of doing. for example i saw an monk preaching the dharma, then a mosquito flew on his face and the monk just hit it away. actually, he had not intention of hitting it away, but it just happen too fast and the hand just automatically reacted. that automatic reaction is the "habit" that had been accumulated during his previous lifes. to stopped it all of a sudden is not so possible. u need some time. /\
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Originally posted by sinweiy:
yes they still have habitual spontaneous “reaction” of the greed that maybe due to so long period in the past become sort of uncontrollable. the mind really no greed, and they CAN end samsara of the six realm. but the body sometimes can act out of a sudden without the intention of doing. for example i saw an monk preaching the dharma, then a mosquito flew on his face and the monk just hit it away. actually, he had not intention of hitting it away, but it just happen too fast and the hand just automatically reacted. that automatic reaction is the “habit” that had been accumulated during his previous lifes. to stopped it all of a sudden is not so possible. u need some time.
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is that monk an arahant first? second your analogy here doesnt sound convincing. dun say past lives, you can just refer to drunkards in this lifetime will do. the reaction is automatic due to flight or fight human mechanism.and what you mean by can end samsara? there will be no more rebirth anymore, end of suffering attained.
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Originally posted by sinweiy:
our take according to Mahayana is that arahat(not "maha"-Arahat) indeed severed affflictions and attachment, but still have the habits of attachment/higher form of greed. pacceka Buddha on the other hand had no more habits of attachment, but still have dualism/higher form of hatred. then bodhisttvas go on to sever dualism, but still have dualism habits. if there's no more dualism habits, then he's a buddha, within the ten realm, not full Buddha yet, he still have wandering thoughts/higher form of folly. if no more wandering thoughts then he's a real Full Buddha. but this also need a standard 3 great Asankhyeya kalpas. the time is also to collect merits and omniscience.
阿罗汉è§�æ€�烦æ�¼æ–了，也就是执著æ–äº†ï¼Œæ‰§è‘—ä¹ æ°”æ²¡æ–ï¼Œé˜¿ç½—æ±‰æœ‰ä¹ æ°”ï¼›å¦‚æžœä¹ æ°”æ–掉之å�Žï¼Œå°±å�«è¾Ÿæ”¯ä½›ï¼Œä¸�å�«é˜¿ç½—æ±‰ï¼Œè¾Ÿæ”¯ä½›æ˜¯è¿žæ‰§è‘—ä¹ æ°”éƒ½æ²¡æœ‰äº†ï¼Œä½†æ˜¯ä»–æœ‰åˆ†åˆ«ï¼Œæ‰§è‘—ä¹ æ°”æ²¡æœ‰äº†ï¼Œä»–æœ‰åˆ†åˆ«ï¼›åˆ†åˆ«æ–掉之å�Žï¼Œä»–å�‡ä¸€çº§ï¼Œä»–å�«è�©è�¨ï¼Œä»–ä¸�å�«è¾Ÿæ”¯ä½›ï¼Œå�«è�©è�¨ï¼Œè�©è�¨æœ‰åˆ†åˆ«çš„ä¹ æ°”ï¼›åˆ†åˆ«çš„ä¹ æ°”æ–掉之å�Žï¼Œä»–å�«å�šä½›äº†ï¼Œå��法界里é�¢çš„佛；å��æ³•ç•Œçš„ä½›åˆ†åˆ«çš„ä¹ æ°”æ–了，他还有起心动念，起心动念是妄想，什么时候妄想æ–了，ä¸�起心ã€�ä¸�动念了，他就超越å��法界，就到一真法界去，这是真佛。å��法界里é�¢çš„ä½›å�«ç›¸ä¼¼ä½›ï¼Œä¸�是真的，相似，很åƒ�，ä¸�是真的；起心动念æ–掉，这æ‰�是真的。--净空法师开示
i'm inline with Namdrol on this thread:http://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f=69&t=5102regarding sudden/gradual enlightenment. final aim is full enlightenment. sudden is almost impossible. frm 1st stage to full need 3 great asankhyeya kalpas, where they complete the accumulating of merit and omniscience (二足two collections). its non practice state of letting ignorance habit wear off itself. "There is no difference at all in the realization of emptiness of a first stage bodhisattva and a Buddha. But there is a difference in affliction and omniscience."
in PL school, Amitabha just achieved Buddhahood 10 great kalpa ago. and those achieved Buddhahood within this period in PL are innumberable, more than half the populations in PL, so can rough average 5,6,7 kalpa to achieved Buddhahood, which is inconcievable comparing to 3 great asankhyeya kalpas.
Seriously,do you know what you have copied and pasted?
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Seriously sinweiy do you know what you have copied and pasted?
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i notice two of such cases, one from a popular great Mahayana master and one from a great Varjayana master. bodhisattva stage also around there. pacceka Buddha should not have such reactions. perhaps he use to met Buddha in previous life, and cannot attained enlighten then, so this life become pacceka Buddha. such habitual reactions can be ended. it's different from walking mechanism. it's got to do with negative karma vs neutral karma. as the hitting a mosquito is a killing negative karma.
Mahayana got 6 samsaric realms, and above it, got 4 noble realms. 6 samsaric realms is 内凡(inside ordinary), 4 noble realms is 外凡(outside ordinary). 4 noble realms also need to escape.
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Originally posted by lastime:
Seriously sinweiy do you know what you have copied and pasted?
which one? last part is i wrote also.
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Originally posted by whylikethatah:
he says he is at stage 5 to 6 worr..
First of all, whether or not he realized what the Buddha realized, perhaps it is best to respect whatever he has to offer rather than make sarcastic remarks about it - asking or questioning his claims is ok as I do that sometimes myself, but just try to be respectful. Since his advices are coming from genuine intentions, experience and insights. If he made a mistake comparing his experience and insight with Buddha (which is far more common than you think) - it is because there is a lack of understanding that there are different levels of insights and enlightenment is not just a one-stage, final event sort of thing. There is a lack of understanding the difference between I AM and Non-dual awareness, non-dual with anatta, anatta with emptiness/d.o., Advaita Vedanta and Buddhism, etc. Few and rarely do teachers speak about the differences.
And therefore when such people attain certain insights and experiences, they think that that is it. This is final. There is complete certainty about what he realized - and so he thinks what he realized therefore must be what the Buddha, and the other great sages realized, too. Such statements usually aren't made out of pride but are expressed out of the full confidence they have in seeing an aspect of reality, and partially because of their ignorance and extrapolation. While they do have some true insight and experiences, what they have seen is not the full picture.
In other words, there is a lack of pointers, maps, etc - or there are, but they simply aren't well known or taught well enough. So of course most people will have false ideas about what enlightenment is, or what exactly the Buddha realised and so on.
I commented that he is at Stage 4 based on some of the comments he made.
First is his insight of non-dual. This wasn't as explicitly expressed in other videos and if not for this video, I would not have commented that he is at Stage 4 (as many of the other expressions could have been at stage 1~3, not that they are less important, as each 'phase' of insight offers a valuable insight and experience). http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxbpvVZ0EzU - which he describes life as "just life flowing right here right now, the birds chirping outside, the dog woofing next door. sounds of the computer fan spinning."
For example, in his video 'What is Oneness' - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=43mGPfhRB_Y&feature=channel_video_title, he commented that reality is the space here/now, the canvas in which everything is painted on. If we see that we are all part of one reality, then we are reifying a greater reality, a Brahman, a substratum, which nevertheless encompasses, pervades, and manifests as all manifestations.
This is what Thusness said in his 4th stage, "Nevertheless it is a very important key phase where practitioner experiences a quantum leap in perception untying the dualistic knot. This is also the key insight leading to the realization that "All is Mind", all is just this One Reality.
The tendency to extrapolate an Ultimate Reality or Universal Consciousness where we are part of this Reality remains surprisingly strong. Effectively the dualistic knot is gone but the bond of seeing things inherently isn't. 'Dualistic' and 'inherent' knots that prevent the fully experiencing of our Maha, empty and non-dual nature of pristine awareness are two very different 'perceptual spells' that blind."At Stage 5, we see that in seeing there is just the seen, no seer - in perceiving just perception, no perceiver. No awareness seeing the world - for awareness simply means the perceiving/perception, and the flow of perceptions.
Reality as such is simply nothing substantial, there is no agent or essence the underlies all things, we are not 'part of' some greater reality.
It is like the word 'weather' - to say that 'clouds are part of weather' may be true conventionally, but actually what is 'weather'? Is it truly existing? Or is it simply a label collating the everchanging stream and aggregation of weatherly phenomena like clouds forming and departing, changing, rolling, rain, lightning, wind, all kinds of everchanging factors and phenomena.
So likewise, the word 'self', 'reality', whatever you want to call it - is utterly empty of any substantial reality. It is simply a mere label collating a conglomerate of everchanging phenomena and no other reality, or real canvas, can be spoken of "in which things occur".
This is also the difference between Buddhism and Advaita Vedanta - in anatta, there is no unchanging background behind phenomena at all, not even one that is "at one with/inseperable from phenomena", we cannot even say that "Awareness is inseperable from phenomena" just like we cannot say "Weather is inseperable from rain" - what is weather apart from rain? No findable essence!
That being said.
After watching more of his videos, I think his videos are not so much about an unchanging non-dual Brahman (One Mind), but more about resting in non-conceptuality and sustaining the non-conceptual experience of impersonality/life/universe, as well as No-Mind. Means his experience is at the phase of non-dual, and it is No-Mind, but the insight of anatta has not arisen and his practice is skewing towards non-conceptuality stripped of the sense of personality (which leads to the experience of a universal life living and expressing this moment) and self to experience impersonality and no-mind. No-mind is like the experience of anatta, but not as an insight into the absence of agent, and can remain as a sort of peak experience. The experience is there but not the realization that "in seeing always just the seen, no seer-seeing-seen" - and so the entire practice is skewed towards non-conceptuality to rest in no-mind. This is still around phase 4-5 but not really 5.
This is precisely what Thusness said here as Case 1:
The Disease of Non-Conceptuality
I was looking back at some posts by Thusness and found one that really summarizes the problems of many people (including me, once, and many others I see in forums)...
Thusness:
(31 October 2010)
Hi Geis,
I 'fear' commenting about other's forum because AEN will create havoc in that forum after that...lol.
Jokes aside but I think it is still too early to say that insight of anatta has arisen. There seem to be a mixing up and a lack of clarity of the following experiences that resulted from contemplating on the topic of no-self:
1. Resting in non-conceptuality
2. Resting as an ultimate Subject or
3. Resting as mere ‘flow of phenomenality
In case 1 practitioners see ‘The seen is neither subjective nor objective.... it just IS....’
In terms of experience, practitioners will feel Universe, Life. However this is not anatta but rather the result of stripping off (deconstructing) identity and personality.
When this mode of non-conceptual perception is taken to be ultimate, the terms “What is”, “Isness”, “Thusness” are often taken to mean simply resting in non-conceptuality and not adding to or subtracting anything from the ‘raw manifestation’. There is a side effect to such an experience. Although in non-conceptuality, non-dual is most vivid and clear, practitioners may wrongly conclude that ‘concepts’ are the problem because the presence of ‘concepts’ divides and prevent the non-dual experience. This seems logical and reasonable only to a mind that is deeply root in a subject/object dichotomy. Very quickly ‘non-conceptuality’ becomes an object of practice. The process of objectification is the result of the tendency in action perpetually repeating itself taking different forms like an endless loop. This can continue to the extent that a practitioner can even ‘fear’ to establish concepts without knowing it. They are immobilized by trying to prevent the formation of views and concepts. When we see ‘suffering just IS’, we must be very careful not to fall into the ‘disease’ of non-conceptuality.
In Case 2 it is usual that practitioners will continue to personify, reify and extrapolate a metaphysical essence in a very subtle way, almost unknowingly. This is because despite the non-dual realization, understanding is still orientated from a view that is based on subject-object dichotomy. As such it is hard to detect this tendency and practitioners continue their journey of building their understanding of ‘No-Self based on Self’.
For Case 3 practitioners, they are in a better position to appreciate the doctrine of anatta. When insight of Anatta arises, all experiences become implicitly non-dual. But the insight is not simply about seeing through separateness; it is about the thorough ending of reification so that there is an instant recognition that the ‘agent’ is extra, in actual experience it does not exist. It is an immediate realization that experiential reality has always been so and the existence of a center, a base, a ground, a source has always been assumed. This is different from 'deconstructing of identity and personality' which is related to non-conceptuality but 'actual' seeing of the non-existence of agent in transient phenomena.
Here practitioners will not only feel universe as in case 1 but there is also an immediate experience of our birth right freedom because the agent is gone. It is important to notice that practitioners here do not mistake freedom as ‘no right or wrong and remaining in a state of primordial purity’ ; they are not immobilized by non-conceptuality but is able to clearly see the ‘arising and passing’ of phenomena as liberating as there is no permanent agent there to ‘hinder’ the seeing. That is, practitioner not only realize ‘what experience is’ but also begin to understand the ‘nature’ of experience.
To mature case 3 realization, even direct experience of the absence of an agent will prove insufficient; there must also be a total new paradigm shift in terms of view; we must free ourselves from being bonded to the idea, the need, the urge and the tendency of analyzing, seeing and understanding our moment to moment of experiential reality from a source, an essence, a center, a location, an agent or a controller and rest entirely on anatta and Dependent Origination.
In my opinion, the blog that hosts the articles on “Who am I” and “Quietening the Inner Chatter” provide more in depth insights on non-duality, Anatta and Emptiness. The author demonstrates very deep clarity of ‘what experience is’ and the ‘nature (impermanent, empty and dependent originates according to supporting conditions)’ of experience.
Just my 2 cents. :-) -
Here's another forum post I wrote some months back, which I think is of relevance about the different aspects of no-self, and the experience, realization and view.
I was trained in this 3 aspects:
1. The experience
2. The realization
3. and the View
I will start with 'experience'. There are different experiences in relation to 'no self':
1. Impersonality.
This is the case when practitioners experienced that everything is an expression of a universal cosmic intelligence. There is therefore no sense of a personal doer... rather, it feels like I and everything is being lived by a higher power, being expressed by a higher cosmic intelligence. But this is still dualistic – there is still this sense of separation between a 'cosmic intelligence' and the 'world of experience', so it is still dualistic.
There is also a very important realization - the realization of Pure Presence or Consciousness or Beingness or Existence as being one's true identity. There is an irrefutable undeniable insight into the luminous essence of mind. Actually self-realization is not related to impersonality in the sense that impersonality can be experienced with or without self-realization, however a self-realized person would progress his experience in terms of impersonality. Nevertheless dualistic tendencies are strong and awareness is seen as an eternal witnessing presence, a pure formless perceiving subject. A true experience is being distorted by the mind's tendency at projecting duality and inherency (to things, self, awareness, etc)
2. Non-dual into One Mind.
Where subject and object division collapsed into a single seamless experience of one Naked Awareness.
3. No-Mind
Where even the naked Awareness is totally forgotten and dissolved into simply scenery, sound, arising thoughts and passing scent.
4. Sunyata
My experience here is still at the beginning phase. It is when the 'self' is completely transcended into dependent originated activity. The play of dharma.
Next is the 'Realization'. Having an experience of witnessing, or a state of pure presence, is not the same as having attained self-realization - in that case the practitioner can be said to have an experience, but not insight/realization. Having an experience is not the same as having a realization... for example, you may have a temporary experience where the sense of separation between experiencer and experience suddenly and temporarily dissolves or there is the sense that subject and object has merged... temporarily. This is not yet the realization of non-duality... the realization that separation has been false right from the beginning... there never was separation.
Hence having non-dual samadhis are *not* enlightenment... why? The realization that there never was separation to begin with, hasn't arisen. Therefore you can only have temporary glimpses and experiences of non-dual... where the latent dualistic tendencies continue to surface... and not have seamless, effortless seeing.
And even after seeing through this separation, you may have the realization of non-dual but still fall into substantial non-duality, or One Mind. Why? This is because though we have overcome the bond of duality, our view of reality is still seeing it as 'inherent'. Our view or framework has it that reality must have an inherent essence or substance to it, something permanent, independent, ultimate. So though everything is experienced without separation, the mind still can't overcome the idea of a source. The mind kept coming back to a 'source' and is unable to break-through and find the constant need to rest in an ultimate reality in which everything is a part of... a Mind, an Awareness, a Self.... what this results is a subtle tendency to cling, to sink back to a ground, a source, and so transience cannot be fully appreciated for what it is. It is an important phase however, as for the first time phenomena are no longer seen as 'happening IN Awareness' but 'happening AS Awareness' – Awareness is its object of perception, Awareness is expressing itself as every moment of manifest perception.
However, there is still a constant referencing back to the One Awareness. Until you see that the idea itself is merely a thought, and everything is merely thoughts, sights, sounds, disjoint, disperse, insubstantial. There, a change of view takes place... experience remains non-dual but without the view of 'everything is inside me/everything is an expression of ME' but 'there is just thoughts, sight, sound, taste' – just manifestation. At this point you realize no self in the sense of Anatta – just sight, sound, thoughts, with no one behind or linking them. After anatta, you can then proceed to experience and realize how every experience, every manifestation is the interaction of the entire universe... the total exertion of the universe, the totality of causes and conditions, gives rise to this moment of manifestation.
p.s. described more in my e-journal/e-book, http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2010/12/my-e-booke-journal.htmlI forgot to mention, when you are at the peak of one mind, you will enter no mind territory where source, mind, awareness is forgotten and what's left is the world as it is. But it remains a temporary peak experience until realisation of anatta arises and results in a change of view and therefore effortless and seamless experience. What led me to the realisation of anatta is the contemplation on bahiya sutta so you might want to try that. http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2010/10/my-commentary-on-bahiya-sutta.html
In seeing is just the seen, seeing is the scenery... In hearing is just the sound, hearing is the music... -
If you are patient enough to read through what I wrote, I'm sure you'll see the link between what he said and what I said. :)
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i think enlightened people don't say they are enlightened. period.