Better, faster and perhaps cheaper ministers?
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Please read this fast before the female mod deletes this topic.
Workers' Party chief Low Thia Khiang and Labour chief Lim Swee Say from People's Action Party (PAP) locked horns during the final day of the 12th Parliament's first meeting on Friday.
As the last speaker to speak from the opposition bench, Low -- the MP for Aljunied GRC -- took aim at Minister Lim Swee Say’s oft-repeated slogan of “cheaper, better, faster” and said that “perhaps we will start to see better, faster ministers at work and perhaps cheaper (ones) after the ministerial salary review is completed”.
He also urged the government to ask itself why Singaporeans commonly perceived the government to be "more concerned with paying its ministers well than about the welfare of the people."
In reply, Lim – who is the Minister in the Prime Minister’s Office as well as chief of the NTUC labour movement —said that his “cheaper, better, faster” slogan was referring to products and services and that comparisons were unfair.
“There’s a fundamental difference,” he said in his speech. “What the NTUC and the tripartite partners and pursuing are cheaper, better, faster products and services, and a cheaper, better, faster economy, not a cheaper, better, faster workforce.”
The East Coast GRC MP also said he was at a loss for words when Low said he felt that ministers served out of self-interest, accusing opposition MPs of taking credit for "the good things" that the government has done since the May General Election by saying that the presence of opposition MPs have brought about policy changes.
Separately, Low also urged the People’s Action Party to refrain from using “doom and gloom” scenarios when debating health care and welfare policy trade-offs.
“I urge the PAP to step out of the shadow of doom and gloom of certain pitfalls of Western liberal democracy and work towards a First World Parliament in our own way,” he said.
Low was defending Non-Constituency MPs Gerald Giam and Yee Jenn Jong's earlier calls for the government to spend on affordable and adequate health care, housing and retirement financing.
Both NMPs were then reminded by Minister of State for Trade and Industry and National Development, Lee Yi Shyan, of the pitfalls of a welfare state, citing the example of a debt-ridden Greece and its welfare system.
In rebuttal, Low said "it is high time the PAP MPs refrain from using this as a red herring to kill debate on alternative solutions and mechanisms to those proposed by the government."
Low added that the government had used the term "policy trade-offs" to defend decisions that benefited them instead of the people. Low gave the example of the decision to build the integrated resorts with casinos and the government "highlighted the benefits to our society over the related gaming and social ills -- never mind the trade-offs," said Low.
Low however did commend the PAP for its "resilience in response to ground reaction" and added that it was not the opposition MPs, but rather the voters that should really claim the credit for recent changes as they had voted more opposition in and that the result is that the PAP takes a serious look at what is happening.
Both Lim and Low also eventually agreed that national interest would remain above their own partisan ones. -
Mr Lim Sway Sway just stabbed his whole gahmen in the foot
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Lee Yi Shyan, of the pitfalls of a welfare state, citing the example of a debt-ridden Greece and its welfare system.
Why did he not cite NZ which is also a welfare state without debt-ridden?
Singapore is not a welfare state does not mean they are not in debt. the report from countries with debt shows Singapore is one of them.
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his fall-bak plan - look at his CPF account to feel RICH
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the old song: "I feel good .. .. . . . .. .. . .. ."
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we need to vote in more opposition in the next elections
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Originally posted by gorgorlokaychyong:
Lee Yi Shyan, of the pitfalls of a welfare state, citing the example of a debt-ridden Greece and its welfare system.
Then welfare for PAP ministers with nonsensical high pay?
This is right wing neoliberal economic garbage. And what about the billions of losses by GIC and Temasek?
I think PAP MPs have too much welfare, just join a GRC and free ride into parliament with over $10,000 monthly allowance.
Abolish the GRCs and compete on your own lah. So useless meh, don't dare to fight for votes alone?
That's too much pampering and welfare. Pui.
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There is NOTHING wrong with the present system after the debate in the house for the past fews days.
Just read the press.
Everything is in tip top condition and it is just a few petty minority MPs that are making noises, which is not part of the team.
Just ignore the noise and live your "see no evil, hear no evil and speak no evil" lifes.
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Originally posted by laurence82:
Mr Lim Sway Sway just stabbed his whole gahmen in the foot
He did?
How so?
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It gives me a better picture of Low
Strong!! -
Originally posted by gorgorlokaychyong:
Lee Yi Shyan, of the pitfalls of a welfare state, citing the example of a debt-ridden Greece and its welfare system.
Why did he not cite NZ which is also a welfare state without debt-ridden?
Singapore is not a welfare state does not mean they are not in debt. the report from countries with debt shows Singapore is one of them.
That's a good point. Everytime someone brings up a new policy or scheme to implement, PAP finds some other country that does it poorly and says it does not work.
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Originally posted by Siliconchip:
That's a good point. Everytime someone brings up a new policy or scheme to implement, PAP finds some other country that does it poorly and says it does not work.
PAP's cheap propaganda tricks.
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Wats the issue here? at least they PULL their load. what DOES a president do? answer that. u cant. and yet he earn ten times that of the president of the USA who works practically 24/7 almost single-handedly to run the world's most powerful nation. to this very day, i still cant understand WHY. WHY? LKY's reasoning of ministers' pay may be reasonable, but this? WHY? i just dont get it. pay a guy 4 million dollars a year to do what? WHAT exactly?
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tony tan from PAP mah. anyway president is a head of state, although with no power to govern, but he will need to attend state ceremonies representing spore. so he has to attend many luncheon and dinners at state function lor.
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Originally posted by Casopia-maplesea:
WHY? LKY’s reasoning of ministers’ pay may be reasonable, but this?
I find Lee Kuan Yew's reasoning to be shameless.
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Originally posted by Dalforce 25:
I find Lee Kuan Yew's reasoning to be shameless.
his party is in power, what can you or me or even the WP do about it?they have the majority in parliament, they can enact any laws they want, you can suck thumb about it
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the elected opposition really worked to wake the govt up ...so, the need for more genuine and potential oppositions is ever more important....but of course we do not want any tom dick harry oppositions...but those who could really voice and present viable ground solutions based on OUR perspective than those rolling out ivory towers or power defensive policies....
in 10 to 20 years time, we may see more infighting....this naturally happens when the most powerful person is gone....
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Originally posted by Rooney9:
his party is in power, what can you or me or even the WP do about it?Their votes will drop in 2016 to 54% and below.
2001 - 75%
2006 - 66%
2011 - 60%
2016 - 54% and below.
2021 - End of PAP rule.
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Originally posted by Dalforce 25:
Their votes will drop in 2016 to 54% and below.
2001 - 75%
2006 - 66%
2011 - 60%
2016 - 54% and below.
2021 - End of PAP rule.
the demographics of spore is changing. the baby boomers are getting old and retired. those born in 1981 is already 30 this year.
very soon PAP support is waning due to demographics changing.
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Originally posted by Rooney9:
the demographics of spore is changing. the baby boomers are getting old and retired. those born in 1981 is already 30 this year.
very soon PAP support is waning due to demographics changing.
They import aliens to vote for them also no use.
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Originally posted by Dalforce 25:
Their votes will drop in 2016 to 54% and below.
2001 - 75%
2006 - 66%
2011 - 60%
2016 - 54% and below.
2021 - End of PAP rule.
We need to import more new citizens then.
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Originally posted by Dalforce 25:
They import aliens to vote for them also no use.
actually we are also aliens, ie descendants of aliens lol who came to spore from china
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First, there 2.2M voters now, including 200,000 New Citizen voters. This figure only can increase.
Second, you are assuming the GRC system won't be around.
Third, GRCs are always redrawn, they can give away one 20%PAP GRC and rule the rest.
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Originally posted by Rooney9:
actually we are also aliens, ie descendants of aliens lol who came to spore from china
Singapore belonged to the Sultanate of Johor before 1819.
In 1819, there were about a hundred odd people in Singapore. The people were of mixed ethnic groups. Most of us are descended from people who came here after 1819.
So, 99.9% of people in Singapore came from abroad.
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Originally posted by Dalforce 25:
Singapore belonged to the Sultanate of Johor before 1819.
In 1819, there were about a hundred odd people in Singapore. The people were of mixed ethnic groups. Most of us are descended from people who came here after 1819.
So, 99.9% of people in Singapore came from abroad.
ya thats why we are also aliens mah lol