Lim Swee Say: Making the economy and workforce cheaper
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Lim Swee Say should have spend some time with Chee Soon Juan, and sat in during the interview conducted by The Kent Ridge Common
‘Upfront with: Dr Chee Soon Juan’ (*1)
abstract:
In the immediate term it is crucial that we stop the mindless and indiscriminate influx of foreign workers. The foreigners are being exploited for their cheap labour to artificially suppress wages of Singaporeans. The foreign talent policy needs an overhaul: Only foreigners with the requisite skills unavailable from the local population should be allowed to join the Singaporean workforce.
Apart from economic consequences, the mass of foreigners forced upon the locals and competing with them for survival will have grave social repercussions which we have yet to examine. Is this an accident waiting to happen?
In the longer term, we must wean the economy off our dependence on MNCs. We have become addicted to foreign direct investments so much so that we have not allowed home-grown enterprises to flourish. Coupled with GLCs, our domestic private sector and SMEs are squeezed out of the corporate scene. During a major economic crisis like the present one, we find our economy much harder hit than anyone else.
In addition, the crush of MNCs and GLCs ensure a dearth of Singaporean entrepreneurs. Apart from economic consequences, the lack of the entrepreneurial spirit has a spill over effect into the social and political circles, making our society distinctly lackadaisical.
Without the verve and dynamism, the quality of life here suffers. This is why Singaporeans continue to be one of the most stressed and unhappiest people in the region and our youths constantly express a desire to leave the country.
Since the beginning of Singapore's Industrialization in the early 1970s, the PAP Government had depended on the MNC's to jump-start Singapore's industrialization ambitions.
After more then 40 years now, Singapore continue to depend on the MNC's need for lower wage environment, and somehow has abandon plans for high-value added input from our workers.
The call in the 1980s and the 1990s for Singapore Workers to upgrade ourselves to climb the next technological rung must have failed, as after 20 years of constant training and upgrading - the PAP Government continue to depend on the MNC's that need lower wage labor force.
While the elite talents guarantee their own astronomical pay checks, they will insist on Singaporeans to accept lower pay, longer hours, and shorter contracts - even as the brilliant Lim Swee Say impose new terminology in cheaper, better and faster on a workforce that is already burdened by failed slogans from the 1990s.
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Originally posted by Atobe:
Lim Swee Say should have spend some time with Chee Soon Juan, and sat in during the interview conducted by The Kent Ridge Common
Since the beginning of Singapore's Industrialization in the early 1970s, the PAP Government had depended on the MNC's to jump-start Singapore's industrialization ambitions.
After more then 40 years now, Singapore continue to depend on the MNC's need for lower wage environment, and somehow has abandon plans for high-value added input from our workers.
The call in the 1980s and the 1990s for Singapore Workers to upgrade ourselves to climb the next technological rung must have failed, as after 20 years of constant training and upgrading - the PAP Government continue to depend on the MNC's that need lower wage labor force.
While the elite talents guarantee their own astronomical pay checks, they will insist on Singaporeans to accept lower pay, longer hours, and shorter contracts - even as the brilliant Lim Swee Say impose new terminology in cheaper, better and faster on a workforce that is already burdened by failed slogans from the 1990s.
This is oppression.
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What a useless labour minister! Only know how to tell the workers to accept lower wages. Are we not cheap enough? Many of us barely have any savings!
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Originally posted by pearlie27:
What a useless labour minister! Only know how to tell the workers to accept lower wages. Are we not cheap enough? Many of us barely have any savings!
The "labor minister" or "Manpower Minister" is Gan Kim Yong.This Lim Swee Say is a "Minister without Portfolio" and comes directly under the Prime Minister Office, with a salary of at least $2 Million paid from Tax Payer's money - even as he is the Secretary-General of the NTUC.
With a brilliant Minister without Portfolio - who is also a PAP MP appointed as the chief of the NTUC calling for "CBF" from Singapore Workers, and a PAP MP as the Manpower Minister - reported in the other thread: ‘Gan Kim Yong says “No” to restoring CPF for older workers’ (*1) - can the Singaporean Worker hope to see any prosperity and security in the future ?
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The economy is moving backwards.
Apparently now they are trying to compete with China and India by lowering wages.
Problem is unlike China and India which have a lower cost of living, singapore's cost of living ranks up there with Japan and HK.
What happened to "value add" or "upgrading of skills" to improve economic well being of the population?
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Originally posted by charlize:
The economy is moving backwards.
Apparently now they are trying to compete with China and India by lowering wages.
Problem is unlike China and India which have a lower cost of living, singapore's cost of living ranks up there with Japan and HK.
What happened to "value add" or "upgrading of skills" to improve economic well being of the population?
Regression to mean.
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Originally posted by charlize:
The economy is moving backwards.
Apparently now they are trying to compete with China and India by lowering wages.
Problem is unlike China and India which have a lower cost of living, singapore's cost of living ranks up there with Japan and HK.
What happened to "value add" or "upgrading of skills" to improve economic well being of the population?
No one can ever hope to compete against China successfully. It is an awesome production juggarnaut. Singapore is not competting against China. We can only hope to complement its production output.
What will protect us will be our geographical location and our population size. We are in the best geographical location to tap onto the vein of trade, the lifeblood of the world, east to west, longtitudinal north to longtitudinal south.
China may produce cheap goods, but still the transportation costs are a factor. We in Singapore is at the pulsating point, a convenient and efficient entreport for world trade. Our production cost will be made lesser by transportation costs China will face.
What we lack in space, we make up with height, as our production areas made quantuam leaps with 10 storey factories with ramps. Furthermore, we do not need the kind of money China would need for its social spending. We are 600 times smaller than China, while China will face 600 times the economic and social problems we faced. Just a fraction of the world trade pie and our citizens can live comfortably.
Thus, there is hope for us Singaporeans and need not fear the future, at least in the next 50 years due to our location. However, by 50 years or more, with the advance of technology and science, shipping as transportation may be obsolute as anti-gravity ships may become possible, with the discovery of superheavy elements such as element 114 to theoratical 126, with its decaying as an energy source.
Thus the need for us to be a 'hub' of everything, a HQ for trade, to be in place for any technological advancement the world willl make, to stay relevant. A requirement for the best education for our young, to always to find our niche for value add and to continually upgrade our skills to meet the requirements of specialised niches.
Think also of our FTAs and ASEAN free trade zones. This will make it much possible for our more adventurous citizens to venture into other shores and seek, create, produce and export products around the world.
The govt had long been derogatively dismissed as running the country as a corporation. While it may be true, but ultimately, it had put food on our tables, the very basic ideal of freedom everyone practically needs. Any lesser being with not a clue on economics would have reduced us all to begging on Malaysia's door to be taken back into the federation.
Once everyone's stomach is fed, from the richest to the poor, where none gets left behind, then can we seek for the evolution of politics. We need not be dependent on dogmas of current beliefs - such as communism, socialism, democracy, etc, but to evolve upon that which will bring happiness and prosperity to our society, never fearing to take the best of political ideals to suit our needs for the greater good.
All these are still far into the future. I only write because there is hope, and need not face it with pessimism but a realistic analysis of our future. Our common dream is within our grasp out there. It only needs us to work towards it now, together as one, in this crisis.
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This is the kind of drivel you get from the state controlled media, already have too much of it in the presses, now it's spreading to the internet forums.
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"Strong and effective tripartism" ahahahhahaha!
Tripartism between unions, capital and government usually(europe) work THE OTHER WAY round, ie: Increase wages!
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The insufferable idiocy of the X-rat continues with its addictive indulgence in seeking public attention to its X-rated intelligence - that it cannot see is a direct mirror of dull intelligence exposed by the bright spotlight that it loves so much to hog.
Originally posted by xtreyier:No one can ever hope to compete against China successfully. It is an awesome production juggarnaut. Singapore is not competting against China. We can only hope to complement its production output.
With China production capacity acknowledged as an awesome production juggernaut - what role does the X-rated intelligence hope for Singapore to complement China's production output ?
Can Singapore role complement China's - when the PAP Government insist on lowering Singaporean wages to support the MNCs existence in Singapore ?
What purpose will the MNC position be in Singapore if not to compete with China in doing the same work "cheaper, better and faster" ?
Has the X-rat decide to drop its defense to the idiocy of its mentor in Minister-without-Portfolio, Lim Swee Say ?
What will protect us will be our geographical location and our population size. We are in the best geographical location to tap onto the vein of trade, the lifeblood of the world, east to west, longtitudinal north to longtitudinal south.
Can "our geographical location to tap onto the vein of trade, the lifeblood of the world, east to westl longitudinal north to longitudinal south" be possible - when there are plans afoot to redirect the trade routes with new trade lines open both by changes in political reality and climate changes ?
Politics have found new co-operation between Middle-east funds and Southeast Asian politics to build a new canal at the narrowest nexus in the Isthmus of Kra that allow VCCL to traverse between the Bay of Bengal to the South China Sea and onwards - avoiding the congested maritime traffic in the narrow Straits of Malacca, and bypassing Singapore completely.
Large ocean vessels are already sailing from the Middle-east directly to East Asia via the Sunda Straits and have avoided the Malacca Straits - is there nothing to prevent the vessel to avoid Singapore ?
As matters stand, with climate changes affecting the northern polar cap, it has opened new sea routes transporting goods from Europe to East Asia which by-passed the traditional routes via the Suez Canal, Indian Ocean, Straits of Malacca, Singapore and onwards to East Asia - and vice versa - and at significant time saving.
Is our population size of 4.5 Million of any significance in protecting Singapore ?
How do you propose this be achieved ?
Are you backtracking on your ‘previous remarks in the other thread that our small population size cannot even produce a talent nor a market size to support even a singer’s ambition’ (*1) ?
China may produce cheap goods, but still the transportation costs are a factor. We in Singapore is at the pulsating point, a convenient and efficient entreport for world trade. Our production cost will be made lesser by transportation costs China will face.
Can Singapore's transportation costs advantage alone overwhelm the cheaper production costs in China - that have been achieved by lower manpower costs, lower land costs, and larger economies of scale in production and market size ?
Are you serious that China's juggernaut production size and wealth cannot allow it to set up its own larger fleet of merchant vessels to be independent of other shipping lines and make its own shipping rates to undercut the existing competition ?
The dim witted imagination of the X-rated intelligence must have been made worst by taking in too much of its own hot gas that it offers so willingly without any circumspect.
What we lack in space, we make up with height, as our production areas made quantuam leaps with 10 storey factories with ramps. Furthermore, we do not need the kind of money China would need for its social spending. We are 600 times smaller than China, while China will face 600 times the economic and social problems we faced. Just a fraction of the world trade pie and our citizens can live comfortably.
Where is the fraction of the world trade for Singapore today when China's GDP is zooming at a speed of 8 per cent, while Singapore barely even make the desired fraction with the last declared September 2009 GDP at minus 2 per cent ?
Does China need to have any significant social spending with its economy booming at 8 per cent and a National Reserve that is at least five times larger than Singapore's - and with a Sovereign Fund that add US$10 Billion without any risks taken ?
What Social Welfare spending has the Singapore PAP Government spent on those who are needy and jobless in Singapore ?
Even the personal CPF cannot be withdrawn during the hardship encountered by the long unemployed Singaporean.
There is no help from the Singapore Government, even when these unemployed are forced to sell their homes at a loss in a down period - simply to survive; AND in the process faced new hardships in having to top up the difference for the losses incurred from the lower sales price of the homes that is insufficient to cover the high purchase price being financed.
Thus, there is hope for us Singaporeans and need not fear the future, at least in the next 50 years due to our location. However, by 50 years or more, with the advance of technology and science, shipping as transportation may be obsolute as anti-gravity ships may become possible, with the discovery of superheavy elements such as element 114 to theoratical 126, with its decaying as an energy source.
The X-rated intelligence is at its best when indulging in fantasy in anti-gravity ships ?
The X-rat must be going through another bout of attention seeking hunger.
Even if given the benefit of its fantasy in coming true, with anti-gravity ships created - is there any need for traditional shipping routes to be continued to make Singapore of any continued relevance as an important stop-over point ?
Obviously, there must be a decaying node in the X-rated intelligence to have allowed the boastful ignorance to have slipped through.
Thus the need for us to be a 'hub' of everything, a HQ for trade, to be in place for any technological advancement the world willl make, to stay relevant. A requirement for the best education for our young, to always to find our niche for value add and to continually upgrade our skills to meet the requirements of specialised niches.
Have these ideas not been plagiarised from the speeches already made by the PAP elite talents since the 1990s, or does the X-rat think that by quoting the same will make itself an elite talent too ?
Is there any benefit for all the personal efforts by Singaporeans to strive to better ourselves and support the idea of being a "hub of everything" - when at the end of the trail we are told to be "cheaper, better and faster" and with short term employment contracts as rewards ?
Think also of our FTAs and ASEAN free trade zones. This will make it much possible for our more adventurous citizens to venture into other shores and seek, create, produce and export products around the world.
In the other thread, did the X-rat not suggest that the educated and talented that are found in Singapore should work for MNCs to achieve ?
Are the FTAs and ASEAN Free Trade Zone become reality, or has it not become mere paper agreement that prevent SME and industries from easily moving across borders ?
Is the X-rat prepared to contradict its original statement with this new proposal to make us compete with the awesome juggernaut production facility from China ?
The govt had long been derogatively dismissed as running the country as a corporation. While it may be true, but ultimately, it had put food on our tables, the very basic ideal of freedom everyone practically needs. Any lesser being with not a clue on economics would have reduced us all to begging on Malaysia's door to be taken back into the federation.
If it may be true that the govenment is running the country as a corporation - is it an admission by the X-rat that it is to be derogatively true too ?
Obviously, it is a fact by now that the X-rat is a "lesser being with not a clue on economics" to prevent the fact that ‘Singapore is biggest Foreign Direct Investor in Malaysia’ (*2) ?
Once everyone's stomach is fed, from the richest to the poor, where none gets left behind, then can we seek for the evolution of politics. We need not be dependent on dogmas of current beliefs - such as communism, socialism, democracy, etc, but to evolve upon that which will bring happiness and prosperity to our society, never fearing to take the best of political ideals to suit our needs for the greater good.
Surely the X-rat will soon be chasing MM LKY into his grave with the idea of everyone's stomach being fed and seek the evolution of politics - when it has been LKY's political ideology of "filling the stomach, and dull the mind" when he confronted his boogie-man Communists ?
All these are still far into the future. I only write because there is hope, and need not face it with pessimism but a realistic analysis of our future. Our common dream is within our grasp out there. It only needs us to work towards it now, together as one, in this crisis.
With the X-rat fantasy coming from one who is only keen at plagiarizing the words, ideas and style of others, and re-present these poor copies with amateurish imitation that is made without any shame - is there any hope for the future when the educated will sink so low in their ablity to grasp and face reality ?
If the X-rat intend to take the public stage, it is best that it learn to stand first on a small stool, look itself in its eyes with a more modest small mirror, and listen to himself with the smallest earphones - before he even plan to murder the hopes and aspirations of others, through his premature ambitions to move straight to the center stage simply to satisfy his own passionate vanity to be in the spotlight.
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Way to go Atobe. The resident pest buster where others would've given up long ago.
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Originally posted by xtreyier:
What will protect us will be our geographical location and our population size. We are in the best geographical location to tap onto the vein of trade, the lifeblood of the world, east to west, longtitudinal north to longtitudinal south.
All these are still far into the future. I only write because there is hope, and need not face it with pessimism but a realistic analysis of our future. Our common dream is within our grasp out there. It only needs us to work towards it now, together as one, in this crisis.
Your stupidity knows no bounds. Atobe has hammered many points of yours. I will just focus on the above.
If PSA believed in your stupid belief that we are in the best geographical location, it wouldn't be aggressively expanding its acquisition of ports over the world and reducing its dependency on the Singapore port. But their belief is not in your stupid idea of flying ships that can transport things cheaply in 50 years, but the more realistic belief that geographic routes may possibly change, and that there is risk to overdepend on Singapore as the hub.
An example: Thailand nearly had its project of hammering through its land to build a canal (much like the Panama canal) succeed. In fact, PSA was prepared to bid to run a port at the canal if the project went thru, coz if that happens, Singapore as a geographical hub will be seriously undermined, as ships would be able to bypass Singapore
It also almost always surprise me that there are Singaporeans who believe that it is justifiable to pay 5x to 6x the market rate for political leadership. It demonstrates how myopic and ignorant these Singaporeans are.
The realistic hope of the future is to pray that stupid Singaporeans like you would wake up from your utopian dream, and that the main way to progress Singapore is a change in leadership (or in my case I advocate 33% opposition, 66% PAP), bringing in refreshing ideas to aid in the new era of Singapore's progress.
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Originally posted by soul_rage:
Your stupidity knows no bounds. Atobe has hammered many points of yours. I will just focus on the above.
If PSA believed in your stupid belief that we are in the best geographical location, it wouldn't be aggressively expanding its acquisition of ports over the world and reducing its dependency on the Singapore port. But their belief is not in your stupid idea of flying ships that can transport things cheaply in 50 years, but the more realistic belief that geographic routes may possibly change, and that there is risk to overdepend on Singapore as the hub.
An example: Thailand nearly had its project of hammering through its land to build a canal (much like the Panama canal) succeed. In fact, PSA was prepared to bid to run a port at the canal if the project went thru, coz if that happens, Singapore as a geographical hub will be seriously undermined, as ships would be able to bypass Singapore
It also almost always surprise me that there are Singaporeans who believe that it is justifiable to pay 5x to 6x the market rate for political leadership. It demonstrates how myopic and ignorant these Singaporeans are.
The realistic hope of the future is to pray that stupid Singaporeans like you would wake up from your utopian dream, and that the main way to progress Singapore is a change in leadership (or in my case I advocate 33% opposition, 66% PAP), bringing in refreshing ideas to aid in the new era of Singapore's progress.
I am advocating at least 45% opposition vs 55% PAP.
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Originally posted by soul_rage:
Your stupidity knows no bounds. Atobe has hammered many points of yours. I will just focus on the above.
If PSA believed in your stupid belief that we are in the best geographical location, it wouldn't be aggressively expanding its acquisition of ports over the world and reducing its dependency on the Singapore port. But their belief is not in your stupid idea of flying ships that can transport things cheaply in 50 years, but the more realistic belief that geographic routes may possibly change, and that there is risk to overdepend on Singapore as the hub.
An example: Thailand nearly had its project of hammering through its land to build a canal (much like the Panama canal) succeed. In fact, PSA was prepared to bid to run a port at the canal if the project went thru, coz if that happens, Singapore as a geographical hub will be seriously undermined, as ships would be able to bypass Singapore
It also almost always surprise me that there are Singaporeans who believe that it is justifiable to pay 5x to 6x the market rate for political leadership. It demonstrates how myopic and ignorant these Singaporeans are.
The realistic hope of the future is to pray that stupid Singaporeans like you would wake up from your utopian dream, and that the main way to progress Singapore is a change in leadership (or in my case I advocate 33% opposition, 66% PAP), bringing in refreshing ideas to aid in the new era of Singapore's progress.
What are you actually saying or had said? Is it based on any facts? None the least, except to claim I am stupid. What am i stupid of ? That the fact exist we are still in the prime geographical location? If that's a lie and stupidity, then i cant seem to see how far is your intellect, bonzo. The Thai canal is still a pipe dream, wake up, kid!
And had I commented on any minister's salary, including the opposition as well. Look who is the myopic one here!
C'mon, bonzo, if you hate me that much to be blind to reality, at least try to be objective and accept the truth. A Turd is no brainer and a waste of time for me to respond. Dont make me do the same to you, if it is discussion you seek, bonzo.
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I better repeat myself because some people cannot understand my concerns.
The economy is moving backwards.
Apparently now they are trying to compete with China and India by lowering wages.
Problem is unlike China and India which have a lower cost of living, singapore's cost of living ranks up there with Japan and HK.
What happened to "value add" or "upgrading of skills" to improve economic well being of the population?
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Originally posted by xtreyier:
What are you actually saying or had said? Is it based on any facts? None the least, except to claim I am stupid. What am i stupid of ? That the fact exist we are still in the prime geographical location? If that's a lie and stupidity, then i cant seem to see how far is your intellect, bonzo. The Thai canal is still a pipe dream, wake up, kid!
And had I commented on any minister's salary, including the opposition as well. Look who is the myopic one here!
C'mon, bonzo, if you hate me that much to be blind to reality, at least try to be objective and accept the truth. A Turd is no brainer and a waste of time for me to respond. Dont make me do the same to you, if it is discussion you seek, bonzo.
On the contrary, the Thai canal was VERY CLOSE to reality. If this domain is not your expertise, I suggest please don't come into it and expose your stupidity even more.
The Thai canal project NEARLY started with foreign investors all prepared to put in $$$ to open that canal. Somewhat it was a good project because you could avoid much of the piracy in the waters around Malaysia and Indonesia, if ships were able to sail through this canal. The estimated project cost was US$20billion which was to be shared among several investors. It was the problems in Thailand that put a stop to the project, thereby Singapore can breathe a sigh of relief. Had Thailand not gotten itself into a mess, it was a VERY viable option, much like the Panama Canal.
This made PSA even more determined to expand out of Singapore, because that risk is a REALITY and is now probably a dormant risk, but NOT an extinct risk. So please wake up, jackass. But that's you isn't it? Always focusing on the NOW and the PAST, from your comments "we are STILL in prime geographical position"
I don't hate you, I just think you are pitiful, because you seemed to be blinding yourself to the fact that we are not in a good position to proceed from now into the future. Forget about the past, those were past glories. It's the future that is scary.
Do you or do you not understand that your job security is only for 1 month? That a company can fire you without reason so long as they give you 1 month of salary?
Do you or do you not understand the problems that charlize raised? That the foreign talent scheme has been exploited to the core, that local Singaporeans are totally at a disadvantage?
Even LKY has said that he sees dangers for Singapore in the horizon 50 years from now. To me, that is very optimistic. My view is that the risks are 20 to 30 years from now.
A nation without identity... that's really scary.
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Originally posted by xtreyier:
No one can ever hope to compete against China successfully. It is an awesome production juggarnaut. Singapore is not competting against China. We can only hope to complement its production output.
What will protect us will be our geographical location and our population size. We are in the best geographical location to tap onto the vein of trade, the lifeblood of the world, east to west, longtitudinal north to longtitudinal south.
China may produce cheap goods, but still the transportation costs are a factor. We in Singapore is at the pulsating point, a convenient and efficient entreport for world trade. Our production cost will be made lesser by transportation costs China will face.
What we lack in space, we make up with height, as our production areas made quantuam leaps with 10 storey factories with ramps. Furthermore, we do not need the kind of money China would need for its social spending. We are 600 times smaller than China, while China will face 600 times the economic and social problems we faced. Just a fraction of the world trade pie and our citizens can live comfortably.
Thus, there is hope for us Singaporeans and need not fear the future, at least in the next 50 years due to our location. However, by 50 years or more, with the advance of technology and science, shipping as transportation may be obsolute as anti-gravity ships may become possible, with the discovery of superheavy elements such as element 114 to theoratical 126, with its decaying as an energy source.
Thus the need for us to be a 'hub' of everything, a HQ for trade, to be in place for any technological advancement the world willl make, to stay relevant. A requirement for the best education for our young, to always to find our niche for value add and to continually upgrade our skills to meet the requirements of specialised niches.
Think also of our FTAs and ASEAN free trade zones. This will make it much possible for our more adventurous citizens to venture into other shores and seek, create, produce and export products around the world.
The govt had long been derogatively dismissed as running the country as a corporation. While it may be true, but ultimately, it had put food on our tables, the very basic ideal of freedom everyone practically needs. Any lesser being with not a clue on economics would have reduced us all to begging on Malaysia's door to be taken back into the federation.
Once everyone's stomach is fed, from the richest to the poor, where none gets left behind, then can we seek for the evolution of politics. We need not be dependent on dogmas of current beliefs - such as communism, socialism, democracy, etc, but to evolve upon that which will bring happiness and prosperity to our society, never fearing to take the best of political ideals to suit our needs for the greater good.
All these are still far into the future. I only write because there is hope, and need not face it with pessimism but a realistic analysis of our future. Our common dream is within our grasp out there. It only needs us to work towards it now, together as one, in this crisis.
How come I always have the feeling your posts are drafted somewhere deep inside the buildingsof some top secret ministries...
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Even if Singapore discovers natural resource on its land by luck today, do you think it will still do away with its exceptional manual labour?
I think it's a no. Then we have both human and natural labour in the end.
PAP only wants people to pay and pay.
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Originally posted by charlize:
I better repeat myself because some people cannot understand my concerns.
The economy is moving backwards.
Apparently now they are trying to compete with China and India by lowering wages.
Problem is unlike China and India which have a lower cost of living, singapore's cost of living ranks up there with Japan and HK.
What happened to "value add" or "upgrading of skills" to improve economic well being of the population?
My sentiments exactly. How can you possibly compete with 2 huge nations that has some of the lowest wages in the world? Its a losing strategy to beat them on that term.
Wages in Singapore have gone low "enough" already where most of the less privileged families barely living from hand to mouth. Fare enough, you can't have low cost of living without low wages, but cost of living has been increasing. A more effective strategy is to maintain wage levels, but focus on efficiency and qualitative standards.
Singapore's growth model has been extensive til now. It requires us to put in more resources and labor to maintain it while providing lesser and lesser returns. I think it is good time to look into more intensive growth strategies. The era for double digit growth for the asian tigers are about to end with the rise of the dragon. Its time to switch strategies to more stabilized growth strategies than to compete with a country that has so much more labor and resources to fuel extensive growth strategies.
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Only an idiot in Singapore will want to choose to compete at wage level with India and China....
This is just a reminder of the Cold War when the soviet has plenty of low tech aircraft vs Nato having the F series plane.....Quantities vs Qualities....Now our Elite leaders has resort to the Communist mentality...
if Singapore economics goals are to compete at a first world level and are moving towards high tech and more efficient industries we are not going to attain by importing less educated foreigners to meet the goals. Because they command lower wage!!!
We are not going to be able to attract local talent to fill high tech jobs because they can get better Wage and benefit outside Singapore.
Ask him Does he knows what he wants? Become Switzerland standard of living and having the cost of PRC....???? who would willingly wants to be at the bottom?
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Originally posted by Shotgun:
My sentiments exactly. How can you possibly compete with 2 huge nations that has some of the lowest wages in the world? Its a losing strategy to beat them on that term.
Wages in Singapore have gone low "enough" already where most of the less privileged families barely living from hand to mouth. Fare enough, you can't have low cost of living without low wages, but cost of living has been increasing. A more effective strategy is to maintain wage levels, but focus on efficiency and qualitative standards.
Singapore's growth model has been extensive til now. It requires us to put in more resources and labor to maintain it while providing lesser and lesser returns. I think it is good time to look into more intensive growth strategies. The era for double digit growth for the asian tigers are about to end with the rise of the dragon. Its time to switch strategies to more stabilized growth strategies than to compete with a country that has so much more labor and resources to fuel extensive growth strategies.
I applaud your post. Very thought provoking.
However, some perceptions, In My Humble Opinion (IMHO) they may be flawed.
A more effective strategy is to maintain wage levels, but focus on efficiency and qualitative standards
This was the model the jap auto industry thought workable in the face of the chinese production juggarnaut back when Deng started political reforms in the 80s and started their own auto industry. The japs, europeans and americans were complacent, laffed at the cherys and geelys.
But they had woken up after the 08 crisis when their own auto makers crashed and burned. And the chinese are making better cheaper cars. The chinese are not stupid people but highly intelligent, just like us. In a few more short years, with active wooing of jobless westerners to their companies, Hondas, Toyotas and your BMWs would be relics of the past.
Let us learn quickly now and not make the same mistake non-chinamen made.
The era for double digit growth for the asian tigers are about to end with the rise of the dragon. Its time to switch strategies to more stabilized growth strategies than to compete with a country that has so much more labor and resources to fuel extensive growth strategies
There is no need to fear the chinamen. The reason is political. How long more can chinamen accept low wages? Again, compare our past. Malaysian labour was cheap, but when they improved, by piggybacking on our growth, their wages are no longer cheap as compared to the 60s.
And with such ecomic growth came social problems as the educated growing middle classes demanded more share of the economic pie. So too will China become when their middle class grows up. They do not own every single resources or are self sufficient in production, as Japan was back in the 60s when powered up.
They too dont call the shots and have to cooperate with the world. If the world feel threatened too much by the explosive Chinese juggarnaut, they too will react politically, espacially those with resources China needs.
All these are still far into the future. In the meantime, there is no stopping China. Either we lower our wages and get some revenue, or we raise it up and get nothing, starve to death.
Opening up our nation to welcome cheap labour will at least ensure our intelligent workforce can be placed on middle management levels. More workers and stacked up factories or offices means more of our citizens will have jobs till the middle class chinamen becomes strong enough to make demands on their political masters.
China may have trillions in reserves, but if you work the sums, it means only 1000 dollars per chinaman. One virus worse than swine flu affecting majority of the population and China will be bankrupt by health care overnight. Taiwan, the true republic of china will then just walk in and take over China without even firing a shot.
Our biggest threat in the next 50 years is not politics or labour, for it can be manipulated, but science and technology. When we, a consumerist world import more than we export, we will be doomed. Like the wheels of time, tech progresses unstoppable by building upon current advancement. Science fiction today often becomes science reality tomorrow. Home computers and portable phones are a joke once upon a time in the 60s. Today, it is no longer laffing matter.
Thus, we must always be the forefront in science and tech, with extensive education, and national education for our young not to forsake it for wealth management courses.
G. Goddard and german immigrant Einstein led US to become a power house with atomic tech no other human could even comprehend yet. College dropout Gates controlled the world with Windows OS. Boeing ruled the skies. Nokia and Erricson grew fat by borrowing our ears. GlaxoSmithKline maintain our health.
We must embrace science and tech, grow our own brains for research and developement, buy if we must, to carve out our niche, so that we and our young will have a better future if we are to sacrifice our todays to compete for food on our table.
PS: Can seawater be turned into potable drinking water? If so, our own Hyflux and its subsidiaries or tech such as theirs may provide well paid employment for millions of us as well as revenues as we conquer the world with the patents to supply necessary safe drinking water to dry or soon to dry up regions due to increase solar cycles. This is only one example of tech created by us. How much more new tech we can create, if only we try? Rather than to support and grow our SMEs and local MNCs competing headon with China on the same products and same wages?
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Originally posted by Arapahoe:
Only an idiot in Singapore will want to choose to compete at wage level with India and China....
This is just a reminder of the Cold War when the soviet has plenty of low tech aircraft vs Nato having the F series plane.....Quantities vs Qualities....Now our Elite leaders has resort to the Communist mentality...
if Singapore economics goals are to compete at a first world level and are moving towards high tech and more efficient industries we are not going to attain by importing less educated foreigners to meet the goals. Because they command lower wage!!!
We are not going to be able to attract local talent to fill high tech jobs because they can get better Wage and benefit outside Singapore.
Ask him Does he knows what he wants? Become Switzerland standard of living and having the cost of PRC....???? who would willingly wants to be at the bottom?
Yo Uncle, the buzzword here is to be Cheaper, Better and Faster...CBF another subsidary of CPF
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Originally posted by angel7030:
hey, u are back...
welcome back
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Originally posted by EarlNeo:
hey, u are back...
welcome back
Oh thank you...welcome to Hell! -
Originally posted by xtreyier:
I applaud your post. Very thought provoking.
However, some perceptions, In My Humble Opinion (IMHO) they may be flawed.
A more effective strategy is to maintain wage levels, but focus on efficiency and qualitative standards
This was the model the jap auto industry thought workable in the face of the chinese production juggarnaut back when Deng started political reforms in the 80s and started their own auto industry. The japs, europeans and americans were complacent, laffed at the cherys and geelys.
But they had woken up after the 08 crisis when their own auto makers crashed and burned. And the chinese are making better cheaper cars. The chinese are not stupid people but highly intelligent, just like us. In a few more short years, with active wooing of jobless westerners to their companies, Hondas, Toyotas and your BMWs would be relics of the past.
Let us learn quickly now and not make the same mistake non-chinamen made.
The era for double digit growth for the asian tigers are about to end with the rise of the dragon. Its time to switch strategies to more stabilized growth strategies than to compete with a country that has so much more labor and resources to fuel extensive growth strategies
There is no need to fear the chinamen. The reason is political. How long more can chinamen accept low wages? Again, compare our past. Malaysian labour was cheap, but when they improved, by piggybacking on our growth, their wages are no longer cheap as compared to the 60s.
And with such ecomic growth came social problems as the educated growing middle classes demanded more share of the economic pie. So too will China become when their middle class grows up. They do not own every single resources or are self sufficient in production, as Japan was back in the 60s when powered up.
They too dont call the shots and have to cooperate with the world. If the world feel threatened too much by the explosive Chinese juggarnaut, they too will react politically, espacially those with resources China needs.
All these are still far into the future. In the meantime, there is no stopping China. Either we lower our wages and get some revenue, or we raise it up and get nothing, starve to death.
Opening up our nation to welcome cheap labour will at least ensure our intelligent workforce can be placed on middle management levels. More workers and stacked up factories or offices means more of our citizens will have jobs till the middle class chinamen becomes strong enough to make demands on their political masters.
China may have trillions in reserves, but if you work the sums, it means only 1000 dollars per chinaman. One virus worse than swine flu affecting majority of the population and China will be bankrupt by health care overnight. Taiwan, the true republic of china will then just walk in and take over China without even firing a shot.
Our biggest threat in the next 50 years is not politics or labour, for it can be manipulated, but science and technology. When we, a consumerist world import more than we export, we will be doomed. Like the wheels of time, tech progresses unstoppable by building upon current advancement. Science fiction today often becomes science reality tomorrow. Home computers and portable phones are a joke once upon a time in the 60s. Today, it is no longer laffing matter.
Thus, we must always be the forefront in science and tech, with extensive education, and national education for our young not to forsake it for wealth management courses.
G. Goddard and german immigrant Einstein led US to become a power house with atomic tech no other human could even comprehend yet. College dropout Gates controlled the world with Windows OS. Boeing ruled the skies. Nokia and Erricson grew fat by borrowing our ears. GlaxoSmithKline maintain our health.
We must embrace science and tech, grow our own brains for research and developement, buy if we must, to carve out our niche, so that we and our young will have a better future if we are to sacrifice our todays to compete for food on our table.
PS: Can seawater be turned into potable drinking water? If so, our own Hyflux and its subsidiaries or tech such as theirs may provide well paid employment for millions of us as well as revenues as we conquer the world with the patents to supply necessary safe drinking water to dry or soon to dry up regions due to increase solar cycles. This is only one example of tech created by us. How much more new tech we can create, if only we try? Rather than to support and grow our SMEs and local MNCs competing headon with China on the same products and same wages?
I think maybe your interpretation of the Chinese auto-industry might be misleading as well.
China's auto-industry can survive very much on its domestic markets. If you look at China's HUGE domestic market, and still low wage levels, it would thus make perfect business sense to produce cheap cars in large quantities so that the domestic market can actually afford them.
What they are doing is essentially not repeating Latin America's mistake: Making expensive cars that no one can domestically afford, and deemed to unreliable to export.
America's auto industry was badly hit in the crisis not because it was not cheap enough; but because it went into recession while China still had a gdp growth rate of 9.1%. While America's domestic market stopped buying, China's domestic market barely flinched. And that is why China is a rising economic superpower. It has a strong domestic market, while at the same time it is export oriented. The non-Chinamen didn't make any mistake, they just don't have an economy like China.
Another important question to ask is, "In context of the manufacturing sectors, are wage levels increasing or decreasing in China?"
You'll be surprised, wage levels are increasing, and provincial governments are looking into minimum wage laws! BTW, Something we do not have in Singapore! Hint: the causal relationship of the demand of the domestic market and wage levels may be reversed. Because wage levels increase, people are able to spend more, further strengthening domestic demand
So another question is, do we have that kinda domestic market that China has? We don't and hence we are export oriented. It means we get hit harder by global fluctuations. And if the government pushes down wages, Singaporeans are just gonna be forced to spend even lesser, killing whatever domestic demand we may have. It means our pillar of economics thus gets shifted even more heavily towards export orientation. When the next round of global export dip comes in, we get hit even harder and then we get our wages pushed even lower. I see big potential problems with this strategy.
The next part of your science and tech arguments sounds like propaganda to me. And I am sure the Chinese are paying heed to it as well. They too are embracing science and technology, and they have a lot more capability to take it further than we can in 50 years time. They are buying over foreign MNCs, technologies and integrating into their own domestic companies, re-engineering them and re-exporting them out. Singapore just cannot compete with China on that level.
Hence, I say its ought to be the end of our entire "cheaper" labor strategy and look at raising quality standards, efficiency and innovation. And for that, the focus is not on science and technology. In the long run, China's income gap and declining population may have a negative impact on their primary and secondary sectors. Which means, their secondary sectors may suffer in quality and lack of standardization across its many different provinces. This is not a problem in Singapore. In fact, we may even latch on to this and become final product assembly stations for Chinese products if we were to develop capabilities to support that. Ie. "Made in China, Assembled in Singapore."
And if we want to be more than that, we need to look away from sciences and technology for a bit and start looking at how we can boost and build on our financial services sector. That point I agree with MM Lee, that we need to strive to be the Switzerland of the East or if not at least the UK.
Whatever the case, the strategy of cheaper labor may do us in.