U.S. about to hit debt ceiling - again

• freedomclub

  19 Sep 09, 19:14

  U.S. about to hit debt ceiling - again

  The $12.1 trillion debt ceiling is fast approaching 'over the limit' status. Unless Congress raises it, Uncle Sam won't be able to pay what the country owes.

  By Jeanne Sahadi, CNNMoney.com senior writer

  Last Updated: September 16, 2009: 10:34 AM ET

  
  

  http://money.cnn.com/2009/09/16/news/economy/debt_ceiling/index.htm?section=money_topstories

  
  

  NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- Congress has raised the debt ceiling four times in the past two years and will probably have to do it again in the next month.

  With the government borrowing record amounts of money, the nation's current debt ceiling of $12.1 trillion will be pierced soon.

  That ceiling is the cap on how much the country allows itself to have in debt. In credit card parlance, the ceiling is the U.S. credit limit. At the end of August, U.S. debt totaled $11.8 trillion. That's roughly $349 billion shy of the statutory limit.

  The ceiling is meant to serve as a brake on spending because lawmakers would have to think very seriously before they breach the limit and take a very difficult political vote to do so. In reality, lawmakers really don't have a choice but to raise the ceiling and they know it.

  Put simply, if they don't raise the ceiling, the country will go into default on its debt. The domino effect would be painful, to say the least.

  Treasury bonds would come due but the Treasury wouldn't have the authority to borrow more money to pay holders of those securities.

  The government might be able to come up with some cash by, for instance, borrowing from the federal employee retirement trust fund.

  The Treasury Department also said Wednesday that it was taking steps to "preserve flexibility" in how it manages its debt. It will reduce the amount of money in its financial rescue reserve -- essentially setting aside cash in the event that lawmakers don't raise the ceiling in a timely manner.

  But such measures can only stave off the inevitable temporarily. After Treasury exhausts its options, barring an increase in the ceiling, the value of U.S. bonds, would sink, jeopardizing the portfolios of countries and investors around the world who invest in U.S. debt.

  "Our credit as a nation would plummet immediately and throw the world economy into a depression," said Charles Konigsberg, chief budget counsel for The Concord Coalition, a deficit watchdog group.

  In the hands of Congress

  The debt ceiling was implemented decades ago. Lawmakers have raised it 90 times in the past 69 years, according to data from the Office of Management and Budget.

  Earlier this year, the House passed a joint resolution that would raise the debt ceiling to $13.029 trillion for fiscal year 2010. The Senate has yet to weigh in.

  While lawmakers are almost certain to support an increase, the issue is expected to spark a firestorm on the House and Senate floors.

  That's because the statutory debt limit is more of a political hammer used most often by whichever party is in the minority to blame the majority for the soaring debt. Konigsberg said he expects the debates in all likelihood to be "0% substance and 100% politics. It comes down to two parties arguing about who's responsible for the debt."

  But one quid pro quo that fiscal conservatives might propose is an amendment to create a deficit reduction commission, which is an idea that could generate bipartisan support, he said.

  In any case, the debates over the debt ceiling may be particularly heated because of the unprecedented government interventions that were launched in the past 18 months to curtail the financial and economic crises.

  A debate over the debt ceiling will also intersect with the fight over health care reform, which could cost as much as $800 billion to $1 trillion over the next decade.
• lotus999

  19 Sep 09, 23:40

  so should we keep clear of all u.s. investments?
• Atobe

  20 Sep 09, 00:13

   

  You should have more faith in the USA - as LKY does when he spoke

  Have more faith in the dynamism of the USA - the ingenuity, resourcefulness, creativity of her people, and the size of the economy that can easily create a rebound.

   

• cyberr1981

  20 Sep 09, 04:39

  Originally posted by Atobe:

   

  You should have more faith in the USA - as LKY does when he spoke

  Have more faith in the dynamism of the USA - the ingenuity, resourcefulness, creativity of her people, and the size of the economy that can easily create a rebound.

   

  
  Why should we have faith? Is US a religion?

   

  what dynamism, ingenuity, resourcefulness....etc.? Sounds like a poem to me. Wait, is this poetry corner?? :lol: :lol: :lol:

   

  I just hope they just print print print more greenbacks, and let my gold rise rise rise! 8)

• AndrewPKYap

  20 Sep 09, 05:22

   

  Too Much Debt? Please. We Need MORE Debt, Says Ken Fisher

  Posted Sep 17, 2009 09:00am EDT by Henry Blodget in Investing,Newsmakers, Recession

  Related: TLT, TBT, SPY, DIA, ^GSPC, UDN, UUP

  The conventional wisdom is that Americans are struggling to crawl out from under a mountain of debt that will restrain growth and weigh down the economy for decades.

   

  http://finance.yahoo.com/tech-ticker/article/334648/Too-Much-Debt--Please.--We-Need-MORE-Debt-Says-Ken-Fisher;_ylt=AhJc6CLEaMJq2UmEiEYHDPZk7ot4;_ylu=X3oDMTE4ZDRxOWV2BHBvcwMxOTcEc2VjA2FydGljbGVMaXN0BHNsawN0b29tdWNoZGVidHA-?tickers=tlt,tbt,spy,dia,^gspc,udn,uup

• Stevenson101

  20 Sep 09, 11:24

  Originally posted by Atobe:

   

  You should have more faith in the USA - as LKY does when he spoke

  Have more faith in the dynamism of the USA - the ingenuity, resourcefulness, creativity of her people, and the size of the economy that can easily create a rebound.

   

  I think the problem isn't that the USA is running out of ingenious, resourceful and creative people.

  But that the idiots are far outnumbering them.

• Stevenson101

  20 Sep 09, 11:27

  Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:

   

  Too Much Debt? Please. We Need MORE Debt, Says Ken Fisher

  Posted Sep 17, 2009 09:00am EDT by Henry Blodget in Investing,Newsmakers, Recession

  Related: TLT, TBT, SPY, DIA, ^GSPC, UDN, UUP

  The conventional wisdom is that Americans are struggling to crawl out from under a mountain of debt that will restrain growth and weigh down the economy for decades.

   

  http://finance.yahoo.com/tech-ticker/article/334648/Too-Much-Debt--Please.--We-Need-MORE-Debt-Says-Ken-Fisher;_ylt=AhJc6CLEaMJq2UmEiEYHDPZk7ot4;_ylu=X3oDMTE4ZDRxOWV2BHBvcwMxOTcEc2VjA2FydGljbGVMaXN0BHNsawN0b29tdWNoZGVidHA-?tickers=tlt,tbt,spy,dia,^gspc,udn,uup

  Is it ime, or is economics becoming detached from what i understand from reality ?

• Atobe

  20 Sep 09, 11:36

  Originally posted by cyberr1981:

  
  Why should we have faith? Is US a religion?

   

  what dynamism, ingenuity, resourcefulness....etc.? Sounds like a poem to me. Wait, is this poetry corner?? :lol: :lol: :lol:

   

  I just hope they just print print print more greenbacks, and let my gold rise rise rise! 8)

   

  If the word "Faith" to a cyber freak is as good as a religion, how will a cyber freak understand the meanings in the words that are synonymous with the word "Faith" ?

   

  Who do you think created cyber-space that you seem to have freaked out from ?

  We will not hazard you with a guess to answer the question concerning the size and value of the cyber economy that occurs every second of the time that the globe spins on its path through space.

   

  With the abilities that you have shown, we can believe that your cyber gold will keep rising.

  Let us know when you have converted it into hard cash and offer to buy over this SgForum from Jason.

   

• Atobe

  20 Sep 09, 11:49

  Originally posted by Stevenson101:

  I think the problem isn't that the USA is running out of ingenious, resourceful and creative people.

  But that the idiots are far outnumbering them.

  
  You cannot have everyone to be Bill Gates, Warren Buffett, Sheldon Adelson, Lawrence Ellison, Paul Gardner Allen, Jim C Walton, Michael Dell, Sergey Brin, Larry E Page, Steven Anthony Ballmer and the others listed in the ‘Fortune 400’ (*1) 

  If everyone is an Indian Chief, who will be the remaining actors ?

   

  From time to time, more then any other country on this globe, the USA has been able to produce winners that create something that is useful and wholly embraced by the global community.

   

• cyberr1981

  20 Sep 09, 12:12

  Originally posted by Atobe:

   

  If the word "Faith" to a cyber freak is as good as a religion, how will a cyber freak understand the meanings in the words that are synonymous with the word "Faith" ?

   

  Who do you think created cyber-space that you seem to have freaked out from ?

  We will not hazard you with a guess to answer the question concerning the size and value of the cyber economy that occurs every second of the time that the globe spins on its path through space.

   

  With the abilities that you have shown, we can believe that your cyber gold will keep rising.

  Let us know when you have converted it into hard cash and offer to buy over this SgForum from Jason.

   

  
  I find it funny that it's faith from people like Atobe that keeps the USD on "life support".

• cyberr1981

  20 Sep 09, 12:15

  Originally posted by Atobe:

  
  You cannot have everyone to be Bill Gates, Warren Buffett, Sheldon Adelson, Lawrence Ellison, Paul Gardner Allen, Jim C Walton, Michael Dell, Sergey Brin, Larry E Page, Steven Anthony Ballmer and the others listed in the ‘Fortune 400’ (*1) 

  If everyone is an Indian Chief, who will be the remaining actors ?

   

  From time to time, more then any other country on this globe, the USA has been able to produce winners that create something that is useful and wholly embraced by the global community.

   

  
  We cannot have everyone to be like you either.

• Atobe

  21 Sep 09, 06:33

  Originally posted by cyberr1981:

  
  I find it funny that it's faith from people like Atobe that keeps the USD on "life support".

  
  You would not find it so amusing when you find out that you are the only one to have dumped your money into worthless cyber gold, when the creative and smarter individuals like Bill Gates, Warren Buffett and the rest of the Fortune 400 still have faith in the USD.

   

   

• Atobe

  21 Sep 09, 06:40

  Originally posted by cyberr1981:

  
  We cannot have everyone to be like you either.

  
  Thankfully we do not have too many clones here, otherwise we will be talking to ourselves; and surely there are more then enough of insufferable clowns to entertain everyone.

   

• angel7030

  21 Sep 09, 09:54

  Originally posted by cyberr1981:

  
  I find it funny that it's faith from people like Atobe that keeps the USD on "life support".

  
  

• angel7030

  21 Sep 09, 09:58

  Originally posted by Atobe:

  
  You would not find it so amusing when you find out that you are the only one to have dumped your money into worthless cyber gold, when the creative and smarter individuals like Bill Gates, Warren Buffett and the rest of the Fortune 400 still have faith in the USD.

   

   

  
  Those are americans rich,..if they got no faith, USD will be long gone, but that is only on the front porch that they are saying, afterall it is their country, but do you know that in their backyard, they are buying euro and reminbi?? The treasury sells bonds to China, and the Americans rich buy them back in China with Reminbi inorder to get a hold of American economy, do you know that??? Dun sleep and blur blur hor...the equity market is the best market now,..especially China equity.  

• cyberr1981

  21 Sep 09, 12:30

  Originally posted by Atobe:

  
  You would not find it so amusing when you find out that you are the only one to have dumped your money into worthless cyber gold, when the creative and smarter individuals like Bill Gates, Warren Buffett and the rest of the Fortune 400 still have faith in the USD.

   

  
  Me? The only one who invested in gold and make gold rises to high prices in today??   

  Thanks, you flattered me. I'm not that rich to buy all the gold that causes US Mint to be "temporarily suspended because of unprecedented demand for American Eagle Gold Bullion Coins".

  - Quoted directly from US Mint websai.   

• cyberr1981

  21 Sep 09, 12:42

  Originally posted by angel7030:

  
  Those are americans rich,..if they got no faith, USD will be long gone, but that is only on the front porch that they are saying, afterall it is their country, but do you know that in their backyard, they are buying euro and reminbi?? The treasury sells bonds to China, and the Americans rich buy them back in China with Reminbi inorder to get a hold of American economy, do you know that??? Dun sleep and blur blur hor...the equity market is the best market now,..especially China equity.  

  
  You want to know what americans are writing in their forums?

  I would love to give the URL of a US forum but not sure if other forums' URLs are allowed here.

  In that forum, on and off, there're people "showcasing" their collection of gold bars/coins. Some collections are in such amounts that they can stack a "LEGOland" out of gold bars/coins. There's another guy who talks about having 90% of his savings in gold and 10% in cash to pay bills.

  I wanted to post pics of Singapore Mint Lunar gold coins that I have, but I'm afraid my humble collection might be ridiculed. Or maybe SGD is still stable and my buying of gold is merely for numismatics.

  Faith in USD?? Hmmm.... Let me think.... There's a forumer who posted a pic of a waste paper bin holding crushed pieces of greenbacks notes. How's that?   

• noahnoah

  21 Sep 09, 12:49

  I think we better start worrying

  for ourselves first before

  talking about so much about US and its ppl

  dont worry so much for them,

  US dun fall so easily

• cyberr1981

  21 Sep 09, 12:55

  Originally posted by noahnoah:

  I think we better start worry

  for ourselves first before

  talking about so much about US and its ppl

  dont worry so much for them,

  US dun fall so easily

  
  USD don't fall so easily; it's a slow but gradual decline.

   

• Short Ninja

  21 Sep 09, 12:58

  Americans don't aim for the ceiling they aim for the sky that way it is more thrilling when they freefall down without a parachute.

• cyberr1981

  21 Sep 09, 13:08

  Originally posted by Short Ninja:

  Americans don't aim for the ceiling they aim for the sky that way it is more thrilling when they freefall down without a parachute.

  
  While at it, they still sell tonnes of gold to "stabilise" gold prices..... opps, I mean "save the poor" in other countries.

  How noble!

• angel7030

  21 Sep 09, 13:40

  Originally posted by cyberr1981:

  
  You want to know what americans are writing in their forums?

  I would love to give the URL of a US forum but not sure if other forums' URLs are allowed here.

  In that forum, on and off, there're people "showcasing" their collection of gold bars/coins. Some collections are in such amounts that they can stack a "LEGOland" out of gold bars/coins. There's another guy who talks about having 90% of his savings in gold and 10% in cash to pay bills.

  I wanted to post pics of Singapore Mint Lunar gold coins that I have, but I'm afraid my humble collection might be ridiculed. Or maybe SGD is still stable and my buying of gold is merely for numismatics.

  Faith in USD?? Hmmm.... Let me think.... There's a forumer who posted a pic of a waste paper bin holding crushed pieces of greenbacks notes. How's that?   

  
  sure, why not, it is not that i dun chat with americians, even americans prisoners i also chat with them, and they are thousand times more violence than here,..no big deal. This is global, you want to show your gold cock or ass, go ahead, nobody is going to stop you. I myself got not much faith in USD, you show me for what??? from 80s of $2.50 to now $1.40 and hovering, you expect us to have faith. One US of A forumer told me, there is about 300 millions weird peoples in their country,..what more can i say?? 

• Stevenson101

  21 Sep 09, 22:02

  Originally posted by Atobe:

  
  You cannot have everyone to be Bill Gates, Warren Buffett, Sheldon Adelson, Lawrence Ellison, Paul Gardner Allen, Jim C Walton, Michael Dell, Sergey Brin, Larry E Page, Steven Anthony Ballmer and the others listed in the ‘Fortune 400’ (*1) 

  If everyone is an Indian Chief, who will be the remaining actors ?

   

  From time to time, more then any other country on this globe, the USA has been able to produce winners that create something that is useful and wholly embraced by the global community.

   

  Correct.

  I'm just more concerned about the rising number of actors and general lack of replacement rate for decent Indian Chiefs.

  Oh, i'm sure it had nothing to do with the USA being the only intact industrial superpower standing after the two World Wars that ravaged the previous center of educated learning.

• Atobe

  22 Sep 09, 07:50

  Originally posted by angel7030:

  
  Those are americans rich,..if they got no faith, USD will be long gone, but that is only on the front porch that they are saying, afterall it is their country, but do you know that in their backyard, they are buying euro and reminbi?? The treasury sells bonds to China, and the Americans rich buy them back in China with Reminbi inorder to get a hold of American economy, do you know that??? Dun sleep and blur blur hor...the equity market is the best market now,..especially China equity.  

  
  Can we leave it to a Taiwanese "hum" to know the workings of the Fortune 400 ?

  Is it not amazing that with the knowledge that you have, you will remain stuck in your worthless positon as a "hum" ?

  Only a "hum" will continue to loudly boast her ignorance that Bill Gates and Warren Buffett will need to run around in circles to keep their wealth intact.

  Do they need to buy Euro and Reminbi, and buy back the supposedly worthless US Treasury Bonds in Reminbi again ?

  Can the worthless "hum" work out the mechanics to the profits and loss for such round about ways of conducting deals in the magnitude involved ?

  It is obvious that the "hum" is unaware that most of those listed in the Fortune 400 are already in their 60s, and are enjoying their accumulated fortunes - with Bill Gates setting up Trust Funds in aid of charity work, and Warren Buffett already giving away almost all of his fortune to the charity trust fund created by Bill Gates and his wife.

  The "hum" should learn to give more time to her specialty and spend less time living in her "fantasy lai lai lai" World, thinking that everyone should work like her by going through the back doors for all the dishonest shady work.

   

• Atobe

  22 Sep 09, 07:56

  Originally posted by angel7030:

  
  sure, why not, it is not that i dun chat with americians, even americans prisoners i also chat with them, and they are thousand times more violence than here,..no big deal. This is global, you want to show your gold cock or ass, go ahead, nobody is going to stop you. I myself got not much faith in USD, you show me for what??? from 80s of $2.50 to now $1.40 and hovering, you expect us to have faith. One US of A forumer told me, there is about 300 millions weird peoples in their country,..what more can i say?? 

  
  Another "fantasy story" from the minds of a worthless "hum" living in its "nutshell" and talking like a "nut".

  A Taiwanese "hum" stuck in a "shell" and talking to "americans prisoners" ?

  The "hum" must be living alone for too long in the "nutshell" and hearing voices too ?

  Only a "hum" living in a "nutshell" will believe that the other 300 million "hums" are weird.

  Can we trust the opinion of an ignorant "hum" from Taiwan ?