Conscript system is causing rifts in society
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Originally posted by charlize:
If I am not mistaken, PRs have to decide when their sons are of a certain age, to declare whether their sons will take up sg citizenship and hence serve NS later on.
I have got a lot of PR friends who are contemplating this issue and likely will not want their sons to take up sg citizenship because of the NS issue.
What's the point of sg citizenship when their sons could easily come back as PRs (like their parents) and continue to live and work in singapore without the national responsibilities?
As for new citizens and their sons, I guess they will experience the same problems that Singaporean males are facing when they realise the additional responsibilities they are carrying and the government continues to favour foreigners over their sons.
And what age is this for them to declare?
And the sons coming back as PR means they have to be much older to avoid NS.
I see a disparency in the system. Pardon me, anyone can explain how it works?
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I just don't want to serve army only.
In Singapore, The boys spend 2.5 years of their life serving the nation. The boys loose out in employment opportunities by 2 years. Then they lose the pechant to study further due to the long NS duty and numerous psychological taunts in NS by their superiors.
Not to mention some of them die.
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Originally posted by Socialist:
And what age is this for them to declare?
And the sons coming back as PR means they have to be much older to avoid NS.
I see a disparency in the system. Pardon me, anyone can explain how it works?
I believe it is before the age of 16 years old.
What is stopping the son from studying overseas after age 16 and coming back as a PR after he finishes college?
Officially, I read that this would impact the son's eligibility to return as a PR but then who keeps track of such things given singapore's excessively open economy? I don't believe they will stop the son from working and staying in singapore. After all, singapore always wants "foreign talent" so I don't see a problem.
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And for those people who think NS is just 2 years, think again.
There is reservist for the next 10 over years after those 2 years.
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Originally posted by charlize:
I believe it is before the age of 16 years old.
What is stopping the son from studying overseas after age 16 and coming back as a PR after he finishes college?
Officially, I read that this would impact the son's eligibility to return as a PR but then who keeps track of such things given singapore's excessively open economy? I don't believe they will stop the son from working and staying in singapore. After all, singapore always wants "foreign talent" so I don't see a problem.
can the parents afford to send him overseas in the first place? Think this loophole is meant for the rich PRs, no the average joe.
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Originally posted by Socialist:
can the parents afford to send him overseas in the first place? Think this loophole is meant for the rich PRs, no the average joe.
Overseas could mean just studying across the causeway.
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Originally posted by charlize:
I believe it is before the age of 16 years old.
What is stopping the son from studying overseas after age 16 and coming back as a PR after he finishes college?
Officially, I read that this would impact the son's eligibility to return as a PR but then who keeps track of such things given singapore's excessively open economy? I don't believe they will stop the son from working and staying in singapore. After all, singapore always wants "foreign talent" so I don't see a problem.
I don't think it is a simple case of PR sending son overseas to escape NS and come back as PR.
Our country must have sofiscated system in place to track these ppl. -
some people like to insult people but no balls to admit.
Ha ha.
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I seriously feel disturbed reading this kind of thread. I am a Singaporean guy myself and I do not mind serving NS.
Call me "brainwashed" or anything you want, but with the country having provided me quality education, social fabric and environment to live in, I really don't see why it's so hard to serve 2 years. It's not as if you're not getting anything from it also. And for those who argue that we are merely serving to protect the 30+% foreigners here, please do not forget that the other 70% is still ultimately our own people - our family, our neighbours, our friends. Rifts in society caused by NS. Ridiculous. Unless the people who comment so negatively have been through a terrible NS period or smth, I can't see the justification in calling the system a "National Slavery System".
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Have you served NS?
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FUCK THE NS WHAT A WASTE OF TIME
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conscript system is causing what??
hmm.. without it, we'd probably have no society to speak of...
deal with it, moron...
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Originally posted by sgisawasteoftime:
FUCK THE NS WHAT A WASTE OF TIME
and i guess you're a waste too..
you know what to do...
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Originally posted by the Bear:
conscript system is causing what??
hmm.. without it, we'd probably have no society to speak of...
deal with it, moron...
I agree with the Bear.
Half of those who kpkb here probably haven't served NS yet and want to dodge it.
The other half... may have valid grounds. That one I don't blame. ICT may be a liability for some.
Still, the first 2 years... Heck. Some are just downright lazy.
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Originally posted by the Bear:
conscript system is causing what??
hmm.. without it, we'd probably have no society to speak of...
deal with it, moron...
We are not blaming the conscript system if it is working, truth is that it is defective and has refused to change with the times.
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Originally posted by skythewood:
people who did not go through NS CAN be discipline too. That is correct.
people who went through NS CAN be fucked up. That is also correct.But that DOES NOT mean that NS does not instill disciplined. Get your facts right
Imagaine there are 100 guys, and without NS, 40 of them become disciplined.
same 100 guys, all go through NS,A) 80 of them become disciplined NS instill discipline
B) 40 of them become disciplined. NS does not instill discipline.
But what you are telling me is that ==> there are 20 guys who did not become discipline, NS don't work. I will tell you to rethink your logic.
So you trying to tell me that the girls in sg is not as disciplined as the guys who went through NS? -
Originally posted by skythewood:
let's play a logic game
will foreigners stay if there is a war?
A) yes,
B) no.
When singapore is at war, will there be 35% foreigners around?
A) yes
B) no
Let's see how the logic game goes.
My ans for the above is both No.
How about we play my game for now?
1) When Singapore is in a economy crisis do the foreigner stays and compete with Singaporeans for jobs?
A) Yes
B) No
2) When Singapore is in a economy crisis can Singaporean's wages beat those of Foreigners?
A) Yes
B) No
Why can't Singaporean lower their wages to that level of Foreigners?
Our cost of living is too high, housing loans, utilities, etc etc... you want more examples?
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Originally posted by skythewood:
yah, and all wars are fought with professional soldiers, not conscript. Just look at WWII
And yah, all the conscript will surrender... And to solve the problem, 2 options. TRAIN them, or give up. and giving up makes sense to you, right?
I believe that most ppls here feels that it is too long. 2 years! training is only like 6 months and for 6 months, half the time is wasted on waiting! Don't you agree?
So what do you do after the training is over? Posted to units and do paper work! So you tell me is it worth the 2 years?
Have you ever been thru NS? Don't give me B.S. Ok? Coz you have to agree with me 50% of the time is wasted purely on waiting if you have been thru NS.
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We are not blaming the conscript system if it is working, truth is that it is defective and has refused to change with the times.
Socialist, what do you think about my proposal to shorten NS to 1-1.5 years?
I think that will be less disruptive to the lives of Singapore men.
Another big problem is the reservist cycle. IPPT, RT are the most disruptive part.
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Originally posted by simnatic:
I seriously feel disturbed reading this kind of thread. I am a Singaporean guy myself and I do not mind serving NS.
Call me "brainwashed" or anything you want, but with the country having provided me quality education, social fabric and environment to live in, I really don't see why it's so hard to serve 2 years. It's not as if you're not getting anything from it also. And for those who argue that we are merely serving to protect the 30+% foreigners here, please do not forget that the other 70% is still ultimately our own people - our family, our neighbours, our friends. Rifts in society caused by NS. Ridiculous. Unless the people who comment so negatively have been through a terrible NS period or smth, I can't see the justification in calling the system a "National Slavery System".
You will once you get in.
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Originally posted by Ah Chia:
Socialist, what do you think about my proposal to shorten NS to 1-1.5 years?
I think that will be less disruptive to the lives of Singapore men.
Another big problem is the reservist cycle. IPPT, RT are the most disruptive part.
I will go for 6 - 9 months and on top of that drop the bloody reservist thingy.
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2 years! training is only like 6 months and for 6 months, half the time is wasted on waiting! Don't you agree?
My proposal is to shorten NS to 1-1.5 years.
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I will go for 6 - 9 months and on top of that drop the bloody reservist thingy.
You are more radical than me.
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Originally posted by Ah Chia:
My proposal is to shorten NS to 1-1.5 years.
I've personally been thru N.S. I know that 6 months is just enough to do the job if they can cut short the waiting and screw up.
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I know that 6 months is just enough to do the job if they can cut short the waiting and screw up.
They need a certain number of active troops, that's why so long service.
I understand this motive, so my proposal is not that radical.
I did a check and found that Singapore NS of 2 years is one of the longest in the world.
I mean what the fuck is that?