Lee Kuan Yew was raised as a baba chinese.
you said this.
go prove that yourself.
Originally posted by skythewood:too long
sorry, you know sometimes it's difficult to make it short, when you have many things to elaborate, i hope you guys could take a look, see whether my conception of some issue is right. thanks
Originally posted by Ah Chia:Baba, Nyonya, Peranakan, i think it is fair to consider them "half chinese", although some would say they are non chinese or "mixed" chinese.
Lee Kuan Yew was raised as a baba chinese.
Maybe half chinese is not proper term to use here, maybe "mixed" chinese is better or probably baba chinese is clearer.
then in some way, the majority of "chinese" across the world are mixed, for they will have some cultural differences with the chinese in china.
Originally posted by skythewood:Lee Kuan Yew was raised as a baba chinese.
you said this.
go prove that yourself.
hey man, i think it's irrelavent even if lee is baba, you need to see which culture dominate his mind, then judge he is chinese or westerner, or western influenced chinese, anyway, baba, or chinese is a name, you need to see what he is promoting,
i would say lee kuan yew is a man who looks like chinese, but inate he is westerner, sorry, i accidentally change his origin. i would say i cannot prove he is purely chinese in his ancestor, maybe some of his ancient family member have inter racial marriage with other race, malay perhaps. But it didnot change his tough position in singapore political arena
Originally posted by constantinePa:
sorry, you know sometimes it's difficult to make it short, when you have many things to elaborate, i hope you guys could take a look, see whether my conception of some issue is right. thanks
yah, doing homework, disguise as forum debate right?
PAP have successfully isolate singapore from china, from china's influence,
Long time ago chinese seek shelter in Nanyang, because the political turbulence, but no one consider nanyang as their home, Nanyang at that time is equivalent to a horrible place.
many prostitute have been traffic to nanyang , and they fear so much of going to nanyang, singaporean chinese at that time is similar to a diaspora jewish during world war, and jews in world promtly go back to Israel when the country of israel is formally established.
and i am not familar with the history, during which singapore's economy grow tremendously. and PAP successfully establish a so called singapore spirit, which is similar to hongkong spirit, means working hard, and striving for success,
and the new generation is born in singapore, who enjoy first class infrastructure, and stable political enviorment, and after the successfully education and building of singpapore identity, the new generation consider them to be singaporean for the first time, and singaporean chinese become a name of different being with china chinese.
the first generation of chinese come to singapore are mostly not educated people. THey may not be familiar with the classical chiense culture, which is the reason they don't develope firm bond with china,
questionable
and now after the english is being accepted as official language, no one willing to read difficult chinese classics, and the only tie between singaporean chinese and china is blocked, that's the reason why singaporean chinese despise china chinese, although speaking same language, and looks the same.
elaborate
Singapore have made a miracle, after British formly withdraw from singpapore, they predict singapore will not survive without the aid from british side.But singapore successfully, building it's economy for post colony period, and successfully establish,"singapore" brand ,in world market in terms of entre port economy,
now singapore have been on the right track of development, but seems the development of economy never satisfy the appetite of singaporean, and the more and more stressful life, triggered by globalisation, and shortage in local market itself, to build up a self sufficient economy.
after economic booming, steady peiord of development, singaporean feel that they are as good as US ,Uk, and proud of it's singapore identity. After the long time to struggle for survival, singaporean become more and more crave to become first class in every aspect, the PAP government already lagging behind to fulfill the need of singaporean's appetite for more transparent and democratic government. And the autocratic government model already become outdated to maintain a efficient and acceptable governance, just like a script in movie, they are looking for something more extraordinary.
being exposed to more more about western life, especially the life in europe, where the human right, is greatly respected, where they have longer maternity leave, and less time in working, singaporean are not satisfied to be lecture by PAP, what is the next step, after the booming time, people realise that there are something more extraordinary, which is democracy, and realise that for so long time, they have been brainwashed, and behave like a working maching.
The shift from making survival concern to have more quality government and life in education, medical, insurance, and social welfare, mark a great breakthrough from post colony to new singapore identity.
And this is the driving force, of calling for a political reform, we not only need money, and respect at the same time, it's the end of singapore's modernisation and westernisation, and the beginning , singapore creation.
i hail for what singapore have achieved, but after all this , we need to think what is the next step, going western way, or going your own way. SIngapore need democracy, or authoritarian with singapore characristics.
this question is what singapore will face during, next10 to 20 years.
And the dead of old singapore and the born of new singapore will prove whether, singaporean is capable of facing the new era of economy, which is the ending of one polarisation to multi polarisation, and the decline of old world order, the rise of new world order, which, the asia and asia market will become a big role in world economy.
this the question, singapore need to provide answer for , and we will witness, whether singapore will uplift itself from first class hardware, to first class "software", from hard power to soft power. it's time to take break, and think what is the next step for singapore.
Lee Kuan Yew was raised as a baba chinese.
you said this.
go prove that yourself.
That is according to Lee Kuan Yew's daugther Lee Wei Ling:
But my father was also the eldest son in a typical Peranakan family. He cannot even crack a soft-boiled egg - such things not being expected of men, especially eldest sons, in Peranakan families.
Originally posted by constantinePa:
hey man, i think it's irrelavent even if lee is baba, you need to see which culture dominate his mind, then judge he is chinese or westerner, or western influenced chinese, anyway, baba, or chinese is a name, you need to see what he is promoting,i would say lee kuan yew is a man who looks like chinese, but inate he is westerner, sorry, i accidentally change his origin. i would say i cannot prove he is purely chinese in his ancestor, maybe some of his ancient family member have inter racial marriage with other race, malay perhaps. But it didnot change his tough position in singapore political arena
I don't know about the history of LKY, but some guy want to bring up the baba thing for some reason. think some propaganda he read influenced him. now i let him question the validity of the propaganda he trying to promote.
I just thought LKY was turning with the tides, with english and then the speak mandarin campaign.
You didn't read the dog's memoirs.
He said that the chinese educated people were highly politicised, pro-China and anti-british people.
They were the strongest political force of Singapore at the time.
He later crackdowned on those schools.
The intention is obvious.
Not to mention the suppression of dialects.
browsing through the pages, correct me if i'm wrong, is someone stating something and when someone rebutts him, he said that it's a generalisation and ask the person to do his own research if he's wrong?
bring up the baba thing for some reason.
The reason is to point out that Lee Kuan Yew belonged to a minority group in Singapore and that he had no population group to draw support from in his early days as politician.
That is probably why he seldom plays the race card.
Because there was no group for him to play!
Originally posted by Ah Chia:Lee Kuan Yew was raised as a baba chinese.
you said this.
go prove that yourself.
That is according to Lee Kuan Yew's daugther Lee Wei Ling:
But my father was also the eldest son in a typical Peranakan family. He cannot even crack a soft-boiled egg - such things not being expected of men, especially eldest sons, in Peranakan families.
good!
Originally posted by Ah Chia:I just thought LKY was turning with the tides, with english and then the speak mandarin campaign.
You didn't read the dog's memoirs.
He said that the chinese educated people were highly politicised, pro-China and anti-british people.
They were the strongest political force of Singapore at the time.
He later crackdowned on those schools.
The intention is obvious.
Not to mention the suppression of dialects.
...turning with the tides. If the chinese were the dominant language in the world i would think we will be taught chinese in school.
Originally posted by tinuviel07:browsing through the pages, correct me if i'm wrong, is someone stating something and when someone rebutts him, he said that it's a generalisation and ask the person to do his own research if he's wrong?
you will have to come up with a good example to explain that. if it involves me, don't worry, just bring it up.
i would say lee kuan yew is a man who looks like chinese, but inate he is westerner,
Lee Kuan Yew is baba chinese.
The name that he used was Harry Lee.
After he joined politics, he dropped the ang moh name since the chinese won't vote for ang moh dog, and started to promote himself as Lee Kuan Yew.
Originally posted by Ah Chia:bring up the baba thing for some reason.
The reason is to point out that Lee Kuan Yew belonged to a minority group in Singapore and that he had no population group to draw support from in his early days as politician.
That is probably why he seldom plays the race card.
Because there was no group for him to play!
So? all these stuff just to say why LKY never play race card? Or you like to play race card alot, and hope people won't support LKY because he is not chinese?
...turning with the tides.
You refuse to believe, then so be it.
You also never go and read the dog's memoirs.
turn tide turn tide, turn my lan jiao.
Originally posted by Ah Chia:i would say lee kuan yew is a man who looks like chinese, but inate he is westerner,
Lee Kuan Yew is baba chinese.
The name that he used was Harry Lee.
After he joined politics, he dropped the ang moh name since the chinese won't vote for ang moh dog, and started to promote himself as Lee Kuan Yew.
that is call tactics. nothing wrong.
Originally posted by Ah Chia:i would say lee kuan yew is a man who looks like chinese, but inate he is westerner,
Lee Kuan Yew is baba chinese.
The name that he used was Harry Lee.
After he joined politics, he dropped the ang moh name since the chinese won't vote for ang moh dog, and started to promote himself as Lee Kuan Yew.
he is a baba i don't know but he have a name like harry lee , it's ok, because when he study in UK, no one can memorise his chinese name, they will think you are an alien, and the english name is the easiest thing to settle in the english enviorment.
hey guys , i have to leave, nice talking with you, keep the conservation hot, goodnight
My main point is this:
"I said that using a certain language [english]to create a culture, the culture created can at best be a commercial culture, or technology culture, or we may call it pasar culture. It has no roots, and identifies itself with a certain material interest. It is the product of expediency.
"It is like duckweed, floating at the harbour. When it absorbs fertilisers, it will flourish very quickly. But once it rains and floods set in, it will perish," he said in an interview conducted in a restaurant in Haadyai, near the Thai-Malaysian border...
http://ourstory.asia1.com.sg/independence/ref/plen3.html
I was disturbed too, by two letters published in Streats in July. The writers are also fair-weather Singaporeans. They said that if life is less stressful elsewhere, for example in Australia, and less costly, why not emigrate? They believed that life would be even tougher for the next generation in Singapore, as shown by the recent decision to increase bus and MRT fares. In Australia, on the other hand, the cost of living was very low - property was cheap, cars were cheap, and parking in most places was free.
Are these two potential emigrants so sure that the cost of living will never go up in Australia? Which other country will they run off to next, when bus fares go up in Australia?
Fair-weather Singaporeans will run away whenever the country runs into stormy weather. I call them "quitters".
http://www.gov.sg/nd/ND02.htm
using a certain language [english] to create a culture, the culture created can at best be a commercial culture, or technology culture, or we may call it pasar culture. It has no roots,
But once it rains and floods set in, it will perish
identifies itself with a certain material interest. It is the product of expediency.
Understand bo?
Understand or don't understand my point?
I not sure why you would want to turn your lan jiao. What do you want me to believe ? That he chose english because he was english educated ? Come on man. There was a need for a common language..not only to unite the population but also assimilate us into the world.
Perhaps. I can agree with you that it is also partly because he wanted to "kill off" political opposition. I would do the same. Without stability we wouldn't have moved forward.
That said, there will be side effects ultimately. You'll end up killing creativity and liberty and end up with a population who cannot manouvre, thinking too straight with all sorts of bias in their head. Some of which post an average of 16 posts in a forum a day and lamenting about his situation instead of going out and do something about it.
yah yah, Singapore should only speak hokkien, speak english mean no culture.
There was a need for a common language..not only to unite the population but also assimilate us into the world.
I don't agree with those views.
It is PAP propaganda.
Originally posted by Ah Chia:There was a need for a common language..not only to unite the population but also assimilate us into the world.
I don't agree with those views.
It is PAP propaganda.
You can always try close a business deal with an Englishman or Englishwoman while using Hokkien.
Singapore should only speak hokkien,
There is no need to suppress dialects.
It smacks of hidden political motives.
speak english mean no culture.
The local culture is weakened. The identity is weakened.